i do see what you mean in terms of the mortar realistically needing an angle lock. it just doesn't seem as fun to me.
Long range and indirect fire can be insanely fun. Like the rifle mortar rounds in OFP. goes more than 500 meters and just sends crap out all over the place. With a very large frag radius You would be able to do some nice firesupport.. I think. Needs a test. Also if it is made for long range you can also add inacuracy to it to adjust the gameplay if the fragzone is too much. Ofcourse it will seem like a downgrade if the RPG isnt boosted a bit if the mortar doesnt really have armor penetration. Then you will be in alot of trouble if infantry/tank is closing up on your firebase. Hmm thinking about this a 40mm nade launcher might change things a lot, but that is a very advanced change..... something to choose instead of the RPG. Im guessing that have been suggested before. But maybe it could also have some alternative use as a flak cannon for planes.
Im all about keeping the mortar the way it is... Its a weapon that takes getting used to; and a rifleman can still kill a gren no problem... Why take away the fun things in a mod?
What's fun for the killer may not always be fun for the victim. I mean, especially when it's unbalanced. The fact Rapehead can kill 4 people with one mortar, means it's probably too powerful against infantry.
Ofcourse...by all means lets follow this course of logic and remove mines, smg's and rifles. Ooh...and nades...vehicles and hell, lets just remove the people too. The only time this weapon is a problem is on close combat maps, just like nade spam.
I just don't see why grenadiers can still kill infantry as efficiently as they do. I see players using these anti-vehicle class on infantry based maps because of their effectiveness. Grenadiers have a pistol for a reason and I think they should have to rely on it more as a first choice weapon when fighting infantry. Last I checked we were wanting this to be a team based game. Let riflemen and scouts clear our enemy soldiers and let the grenadiers excel at what they are supposed to; destroying enemy vehicles.
Okay, everyone here seems to agree that the RPG needs a boost, and most people say it should be in maneuverability. I'm glad we have that sorted out. The BE RPG is a monster though. It's even worse than the BEAR's ironsights used to be, and god those were horribly obstructive of your view. For the mortar, I agree that it's very fun to use, but it isn't fun to have it used against you. As it stands, the mortar is the gren's primary anti-tank weapon and not the long-range firesupport weapon it should be. The RPG should be his main anti-tank weapon. Like most people here, I agree that the damage against armor should be lowered, and the damage against buildings should be upped. I'd love it if when you held down primary fire, it went to a 3rd person view of the gren crouching down and holding a shell over the mowtar while your aim it, and then letting go of primary fire would launch it and let you move again after a second, or pressing and holding primary fire again right away would have the gren pull out another shell. But that would probably take too much new modeling and animation so it's probably not optional for a release soon. The problem is that with the new animations, it takes much longer to fire the mortar then before, but the damage vs buildings was never upped. Infact, the damage against buildings was lowered to stop rocketsniping. As it stands, a single engineer can completely hold off two grenadiers without ammo upgrade, and waste nearly all their ammo if they have ammo upgrade. Two or more grenadiers should be able to overwhelm an engineer's repairing power well before their ammo gives out, because that's their job; to destroy enemy buildings and tanks.
TBH, the way things are set now, scouts, engis and riflemen should kill grenadiers every time. I have no problem killing even dubee when I have a gun, you point and click and the gren is dead. You guys are making the gren to be some superclass that it really isn't, you just need to shoot him.
I don't have a real hard time killing them either most of the time, but what about people who can't mow down 4 guys in half a second with headshots? The point here isn't that they are godly monsters that can blow your face up every time you walk around the corner. The point is that they shouldn't be able to hop around the corner, fire off a mowtar at your feet and already be back behind that corner before you can pull the trigger.
Damage vs buildings for the RPG was lowered to nothing because RPGs would snipe buildings all day. All building resistance to damage was increased so that bases couldn't be taken down as quickly. Mortar does 120 damage. Damage reduction on buildings is 6. 120/6 = 20 damage to buildings. BE mortar takes 4 seconds to reload which equals 5 damage/sec. The engineer kit repairs 1 hp/sec or 2 with the upgrade skill but also runs out after 100 (or 200) hp healed. You should probably bring some friends if you want to take down a building as a grenadier or bring an engineer which is the best class for taking down a building. I don't think I ever planned on the mortar being an ideal weapon for taking down buildings. The mortar's original purpose is taking out players which is what it does best.
See, I had no idea that was the intention- i always thought it was your intention to be anti-building. It's hard to argue against the mortar as-is if the stated purpose is anti-infantry. Like I said... it's very good at that. That still leaves the gren with an RPG that can't hit the broad side of a barn, though. (Or rather, I can't hit the broad side of a barn.) Maybe I should report RPGs being hard to use in mantis XD (nah, jk weedy)
I think RPGs should have a slight guidance system. Just a slight one. Maybe the rocket could be "influenced" by where the laser pointer of the RPG is at. That would definitely make the RPG more newbie friendly.
uh... the rockets already do this. At first it appeared to me that they behaved like the redeemer missle in UT, where it goes in the direction you face. But apparently, they are just like the HL2 rockets, just with a much lower course correction speed
Oh right, <_<. I had a brain fart and I was stuck in the days that I didn't know there was a guidance.
As I said earlier I dont feel like im getting killed too easy by the grenadiers. And I often feel somewhat helpless if I meet other classes as I am mostly reloading the mortar or placing a mine. I would just like to test how it would work as a long range firesupport. Just like in... cant remember the name of the game, But its an improved version of the Battlefield 1942 engine and you figth against some asains on tropical islands. Anyway their mortars have to be set up and you then see a white circel on the minimap or the big map, where you ammoz are going to land within. That led to some of the best teamplay I have ever done. I set up my stuff at a bunker in one end of the island that was on a hill and started bombing another enemy bunker in the center of the island and suddenly two German dudes also set up right next to me. Then I asked for support and a sniper in the tree lines of the enemy started to tell us when to fire . One reason why some people might get shot in the face all the time is because they are assaulting the enemy and they have cameras. I havent used it a whole lot lately, but the times I have gotten the most mortar killls have always been with good camera cover. You can often see people hesitating and then start to run around a corner and by the time they get around the corner, the mortar is already flying.
We'll according to everyones views this is what I have established: Mortar: Anti-Tank/Infantry/Building(Although Nerfed damage now) RPG: Anti-Tank/ Rare occasion Infantry I always had assumed that the mortar was the main weapon for buildings but after its recent damage nerf to buildings I don't see grenadiers doing too much to buildings, especially if an engineer is repairing it. Since in a given situation a grenadier should be able to take out buildings and vehicles, the mortars ammo capacity to its function is relatively small. I wouldn't mind seeing a boost to the rpg to give the grenadier's the ability to be more well rounded with the weapons, and maybe an rpg damage upgraded or its speed upgraded even more. This way it would be RPG vs. Tanks most the time. Mortar vs. Infantry/buildings. Right now I think the mortar is too dominant in all the categories that the rpg is only useful at times.
Making the rpg have a better turn speed when guided, making it harder to dodge would make people use it more against tanks, also the mortar deploys to fast and should take slightly longer to deploy. As grenadiers are able to jump around corners and fire almost instantly Otherwise theres isn't much of a problem with grenadiers
Grenadiers cant go toe to toe with any class; you come close to them they are dead... If you are all clustering around a health crate and someone is actualy smart enough to fire 1 round in there... You all deserve to die... Mortar is fine, you cant go to the front lines with it; you need rifleman to plow through and the mortar to finish them off, sure if you are camping somewhere a mortar to the head is what the doctor ordered any way... Long ranged mortar shots that killed me were the most "WoW" inducing ones I ever had...
