I dont feel like I get killed a lot by mortars too often or too easy. But I think it could be done different. The very first time I played I remember going for grenadier and seeing the mortar. I automatically asumed it was meant as and indirect firesupresion weapon. I saw that there was enemies in a treeline at what turned out to be at the maximum distance and I just started to empty all I had into the small forest... (think it was canyon). Nothing really happened and then an AFV came along and I got it in one hit. I also remember thinking that the RPG was going really slow, but so was the Tanks boom guns. I dont know how hard it would be to test but here is one suggestion. RPG: should be very high speed and high penetration. Low on fragmentation. no guiding. Mortar: very low penetration, but devestating fragmentation. Maybe one area that give alot of damage and another big one where you MIGHT get hit by crap in the air. Chance of getting hit in the big zone depending on your stance. I really like the idea of a movement lock. You just dont fire it lower than something like 20 degrees. If you want to draw fire closer to youself you have to shoot above 45 degrees. Perhaps making it a long range weapon.
I've been gren quite a lot recently and I have a couple of observations. 1) It's damn hard to see anything with the bren models now! Mainly because the RPG has a minor bug with reloading while the missile is still being guided (which occurs about 60% of the time), and also because the Mortar reloads a 1foot shell in the middle of my screen so I can't see what i'm hitting unless it's close [I love them but mortar probably needs to be lowered a bit]. I missed 2 turrets with 10 shells by 4 metres because I couldn't see where the hell I was shooting. 2) Brenodi mortar reload time is up by a second or so. I think you'll find that actually, if you wanted to nerf grens, it's quite slow to mortar anything this rc which is probably as it should be. 3) Mortar is no longer a 1 hit infantry killer. I've done numerous on target shots that would have pulped infantry in previous rc's and found myself pwned. Unless it's a sweet direct hit (and I mean direct because I mortared peoples arms a couple of times...and their feet) they won't die if they have full health or are a rifleman. My mortar vs infantry is now reserved for around corners and over obstacle damage, rather than snapshots. I don't think grens need nerfing. I do believe the mortar should do more damage to buildings (not a great amount more, but still some), less to vehicles (maybe 60-70% of current value), the same or 10% less to inf while the RPG is buffed against vehicles (or guidance is boosted to a weak version of the HL2 rpg), bounces off buildings (seriously I loved that...I know it's weak vs buildings but that was a cool feature ) and the starting clip is boosted by 1 or 2.
So the mortar is good now? You can't kill people anymore with one shot, nor can you just pop out and blast their brains out in one shot.
Gotta be honest, if you're gettin' killed by skilled players it just doesn't count. It's only if you're getting killed by everyone with a mortar almost all the time than it does. If you're getting killed everytime by dubee it doesn't count, if you're getting killed almost all the time in 1 on 1's versus any generic mortarer then yes it does.
Amen. (And reduce the size BE RPG's protection plate. It is massive. Small cuts from the top and bottom would be fine so you could actually see a little bit more than just from that tiny square in the plate.)
I'll say this: the mortar is a very... skill weapon to use. It's kinda like the AK in counterstrike. I can't for the life of me use the AK every time I shoot somehow the bullets just deliberately avoid my targets. but when pros use the AK I get killed off every time. same thing with the mortar. now I'm not a dubee but I'm pretty damn good with that weapon on my good days, and from my experience I know how kill an enemy rifleman as grenadier and an enemy grenadier as rifleman. unless as grenadier I come up against somone my own skill, I (can) kill the other person even if they're next to me with an SMG. now the question is: is this what we WANT for empires. skill weapons. because from what some people here often say about empires is that although there's a certain amount of standardising the weapons, so a rifleman will be better than an engineer no matter who is controlling them. more like an RTS. skill weapons: more FUN to use. gives the game longevity in that it is a skill to master. there's a reason people enjoy counterstrike. standardised weapons: less likely to be unfair on people/ teams - less rambo in games more teamwork. this isn't so much a suggestion as something for people to think about. --------------- my mortar suggestion: it does more damage, the faster it impacts on the target. this means that the higher (and further) it goes, it does a bit more damage. so a close range shot will do 70 damage, while a max range shot would do 150. this way, you can still do those awesome long range skill shots, but not so much just blowing up someone in front of you without them having a chance to react. -------------- i also really like the idea of the large splash damage, especially the idea that stance effects that. aim lock, so no aiming less than 20 degrees wouldn't be fun at all because it means that if you do get on top of a building you can't fire on people below. RPG is much better against tanks at range than mortar. if any experienced (or just not noob) driver spots you using a mortar at range they can just sit there and drive forward slightly and back slightly to avoid your shots. it's too easy.
unless you've got a new physics law, the shell will only be going faster if it hits a target lower than it - otherwise it'll be at most the same speed (it slows down as it goes up and then speeds up on the way down but all the time it meets air resistance). I'd not be against a minimum elevation for the mortar, but it could make it hard to use from higher ground. personally I like the mortar and find the rpg a pain - i use it to try and suprise tanks, you can get one or two hits before they know you're there but then its very hard to hit them (for me). could the rpg be made to be more effective against most armour types but not more against hulls/buildings? maybe not, more speed and not reloading during a guided missiles would be handier.
The one thing that I like about the mortar is that it carries ALOT more ammo then the RPG; so thats why I usually just stick with the moratr
From the way I see it; the mortar is an action weapon. As fun as it is, it's wrong of me to jump out of corners and kill a player or two with the damn thing. Though I'm not convinced that the solution lies in nerfing damage. This may be over the top; but I suggest you change the way the mortar works. I'm all for making a limit on the elevation. Plus, the player shouldn't be able to move when the mortar is 'set up' (As in able to fire) and perhaps the mouse sensitivity decreased. Maybe adjust the trajectory of the shells, so they fly at a higher elevation encouraging you to attack positions behind trees, cover, whatever. Hey, it's a mortar right? Heaven forbid it's used like one. If that's too much, please consider the RPG. I run right up to a hostile vech, and fire away at his sides or rear without taking damage from my own rockets. I'll happily be rid of this douche bag of a tactic
You can still attack people who are close from high ground... you just elevate far above 45 degrees. It will just take longer and you just dont know for sure where it will land. or just use the RPG as a direct weapon. I know this is not about realism.... but it helps just a little if it is believeable... like vehicles having air intaces and so on. A mortar is never fired down.... thats just not how it works. If it does I would call it a grenade launcher. Then it might aswell have shells and chamber. I would actually like to see it deploy and then have the grenadier hold the mortar round at the top of the barrel until you press fire and he just lets go making it almost instantly go off with a laud agressive BANG and that very special whistling noise would be awesome.
Oh here's a question. Does anyone use the rifleman's dig-in skill? That would half any mortar damage if you have more than 50% stamina.
when I'm not using the HMG, I usually take dig-in fourth, but I always take it. If I need pure run-and-gun rifleman effort, I go accuracy-damage up-health-dig in. I think that's a good skill chart, but idk what you guys think.
I havent used it for a very long time. With HMG it feels a bit useless and if im using assault rifles I usually dont have a lot of stamina from running around alot. I always take accuracy or ammo (depending on the generel distance to the enemy). Then damage and healt. Lately also speed a few times for the sticky instead of healt.
I had forgotten that the amount of damage depended on the amount of stamina. This will surely help me out now that i know it again .
I don't think anyone uses it until after a few promotions. Maybe if you get rid of the stamina requirement and just make the extra damage disappear? I mean, you run around a lot as rifleman and with the big gun you can't use the skill at all.....
Create a minimum angle that the mortar must be at in order to fire, Increase damage to inf by the rpg (direct hits should be death) and ban dubee (YES THAT IS A FRIGGIN JOKE, NOT A FLAME) and there, grenadier is permanently balanced.
