A Liar In Our Midst-Guns and Wham-o

I don't have an opinion either, I stopped being active with the game when candles quit.

I don't think anyone deserves a perma-ban. People like paradox shit up the place all the time yet we still keep him around. Why is guns such a special case?
So what he records people and uploads it to youtube? I am on youtube chasing a black kid out of his own home with a hockey stick, I don't give a shit. Why should you?

It's also free game coverage.

 

the only meaningful interacting i've had with whamo basically was summed up by him telling me i should get a foot pedal for my push to talk button

 

Thats actually a suprisingly not stupid idea.

 

sauce please

 

The railroading is strong in this community.

 

Go to youtube and type hermitage ass peter.
I am the giant white kid.

 

this?
[youtube]u7goHi2y644[/youtube]

 

Yup thats it.

 

He has been made an example of which i think is a good thing. This will make others think about doing the same shit as him in the future.

 

A shitty example more than anything.

 

Can we make it clear what he was banned for? Was it the constant asking for admin/mod? That doesn't seem like an appropriate response. Was it the recording? I don't see why that would be a problem as many people have made youtube clips doing the same. Was it because he insulted Vicki? Can't be that either since we're on the internet and BlakkCooper is not 'banished' (wooohhhhhh, spooky), and he insults everyone.

Also what exactly was he banished from? The forums? He only has 65 posts and hardly posts on here. A hardcoded ban from all servers? Seems a bit crazy since he's the only seeder in the community for said server. Just VIPER? Alright, seems excessive to call it 'banishing', but whatever.

'More in check'... please. Do we make a drama thread on every weird person in the community or just when our god-complexes feel malnurished?

 

When players, admins, server owners and even developers come to me repeatedly to complain about someone's behaviour, especially when said behaviour has led to people to leave this community before, I'm willing to set aside my personal objections to banning people from a fragile community and exert a necessary response.

As other have stated, asshatery in it self is not something that is or should be a bannable offence, but what Guns did went well beyond that. I and fellow devs, server owners and admins have all been confronted by and discussed the evidence.

The fact he was an active player as many have mentioned makes it even more distressing. Still, being a vet doesn't excuse this kind of behaviour, and he has been reprimanded and called out for it before several times in the past, including by myself. Nor do I buy the argument that it is somehow acceptable because others might have acted similarly in the past. Somewhere a line needs to be drawn, and that's what we've done. It should also be noted that the systematic nature and severity of his behaviour does not compare to some other names mentioned in this thread.

I would also like to dispel the rumor that my reasons for banning him were personal, or that I was the sole decision maker in all this. First of all, he has been banned by multiple server owners and by me here on the forums. Everyone agreed that his offenses warranted such action, and it was only after thorough discussion that the decision was made. It should also be noted while indeed Guns himself has never been directly hostile to me. He has been caught saying uncouth things about me to others while at the same time pretending to have never badmouthed me, ever. There are also those that in the past have behaved in a rather hostile manner towards me, and those people have never been banned, nor kicked, even if others tried to convince me to take action. As said earlier, asshatery in it self is not a bannable offense.

Second. He was not banned for criticizing me or other developers. Quite the contrary, I don't recall ever having had any disagreement with Guns over the future of this mod in terms of gameplay and other developments. Furthermore, there are many that have criticized my ideas and goals for this mod, often harshly. People are free to speak up if they have any disagreements, including discussing them with others. But again, that's not why Guns was banned.

Third. He was not banned for recording people in it self. Many people record gameplay, spectator chat or even TS sessions and this is a widely accepted practise. However, deliberately telling falsehoods and then recording conversations in such a way that they give a false impression, or even doing so in it self, and then handing these recordings and logs over to admins and server owners with the goal of stirring trouble is not okay. The latter was something that weighed heavily in our decision to banish him from the community.

Fourth. His double-faced nature isn't well appreciated by many, including myself. Some of his (false) comments in the past have seriously compromised trust and goodwill between certain community members, including members of the development team, server owners and admins.

Fifth. He hasn't made any attempt towards apologizing for his behaviour, nor shown any understanding or realization of why what he did was wrong. To add insult to injury, he has resorted to trying to throw others under the bus and blame them for his behaviour, including some of the people that have so far posted in this thread.

In all, we found that Guns was an extremely toxic influence to this community, even when considering mitigating factors such as seeding servers.

And thus - unless all those affected come forth and state they are willing to forgive him - he's not coming back.

 

I have to clarify this again, I am not personally defending Guns in anyway.

But are you going to finally show us some solid shit before we assume this is some black-box&personal judgment?

If by extremely toxic influence you meant he's killing this game, why don't you ban like half this community because we are fucking extremely toxic, especially toward new players?
I have quite a few screenshots with vets/regular players insulting/taunting new players because those vets think they are actually any good at this game, when they are not.

Here's a suggestion for you, create a polling with 3 options. Perma ban, lengthy ban, no punishment, with voters being shown so there won't be alts.

I can already tell you that I will vote for lengthy ban and if you refuse to show any solid stuff then I will definitely vote for no punishment.

"Why should we create a vote? We made the final decision."
Oh yeah, sure.
In the end, I can't and obviously won't do anything against your decisions, but if that's what you guys want to do when this game is almost fucking dead, go ahead.

 

I don't see how people who are not involved and who are not affected by what he did should have a vote, that makes no sense.

 

Not unless you are personally affected. Many of those that were affected have been informed and will continue to be informed about what he did.

This wasn't standard rage or hostile comments. This was an active and deliberate attempt at fomenting animosity between community members through the fabrication of lies, and tampered and incomplete records.

It's also worth noting that the behavior you describe is being addressed and that there have been significant improvements compared to several years ago. If you wish to address this then you can contact the server owners or admins. But again, this is not something that Guns was banned for.

I don't see why anyone other than those that are personally affected or are part of the dev team and server administrations should have a say about this manner.

His behavior is directly responsible for certain contributors leaving the community. There is a reason why this harsh punishment was implemented.

Pretty much this.

 

At some point you just have to trust that the people steering the ship have the best interests of the game & community in mind and let them make decisions.

 

What a load of shit. First off youve been in charge since what, monday? Youre telling me that since then whamo has been such a menace in those couple <6 man matches that you had multiple people complain about him? Really? To you off all people? Not to mention apparently the russians have complained to you as well since i cant imagine trickster doing so and vicky doesnt have a split personality.

If whamo did something ridiculously stupid that warranted a perma then maybe you should all be upfront about this, because so far i see only buzzwords , purple prose and bullshit.

Im sorry i though you were american.

well then whats the point off all this shit then? It can all be summed as "Some people got hurt but we aint gonna tell you who or how". Not to mention all of the talk about the supposed bad stuff comes from a close group of people. Where are outside people to verify these claims? So far only predator has produced something against guns that can be said as being a giant asshole to the community and evne then its got nothing to do with what youre describing.

 

I haven't read in depth the two walls of texthe from catface and security yet, but I will say this much is true: the community is neither large enough anymore, nor has a high enough turn over rate, for "setting an example" in such a spectacular manner to have any effect at all. None are left that could learn from his example. So with all do respect spike, this reasoning is bullshit.

 

This is not a philosophy I subscribe to.

I can't wait to be next.