[2.25] Rpg

Their are many players that play almost only rifleman.
They dont complain cause the class is totaly overpowered now.
I remember a hugh shitstorm back in 2.2 and 2.21 when the rifleman
rifles didnt feel powerfull enough.
Oh and in the fps universe everyone is a "rifleman player" to an extend cause
the rifleman uses the core element of "classic" fps gameplay.

 

The rifleman isn't overpowered, he doesn't have any other abiliities other than better weapons than the other classes, he can't do jack against a dug in engineer or a grenadier on the high ground or a half competent tanker in the early game, the grenadier can kill early game tanks and with a fix to the RPG should continue to pose a threat afterwards, the engineer can build bases quickly and turn the tide by doing so, he can also deploy cover to help other infantry advance. Scouts have that retarded sabotage ability which riflemen have nothing to compare to.

The only thing the rifleman can do is shoot people better than the other classes, and the rifleman has always been able to shoot people better than the other classes.

Engage a brain cell or two before you post please because it's incredibly irritating to see you post without doing so.

 

Riflemen would be fine if it dig in got removed, and they died to mortars

 

Empires does not revolve around personal skill, it is a team game and teamwork should be rewarded. If you want people to play grenadier you will need to make it easier to do so, such as adding homing RPGs as well as guided ones. This is different from aimbots because aimbots ensure that you can hit your targets instantly with no warning whereas homing has a lock on time and warning, also homing missiles can be avoided while bulets cannot.

There are many players who only play engineer and scout aswell but unlike the grenadier they are not pushing their vision of the rifleman in every venue possible. If there were people as dedicated to the rifleman as there are people who are dedicated to the grenadier the thread on rifleman weapon balance should be a lot more contentious than it currently is.
The isssue with the 2.2 and 2.21 weapons was that infantry weapons were a lot less effective across the board and that took people by surprise, people were complaining because it appeared out of the blue and they did not have time to get used to the new weapons.
I am not sure what you mean by everyone is a rifleman as in a FPS the shooting element is generally quite prominent.

Well once the dig-in bug is fixed then we can see where things stand.

 

Post one time without insulting the intelligence of other people and without
the purpose to boost your low self esteem and I might take you serious.

 

Or, assess the merit of my posts and stop making stupid comments.

 

OR you can both take this bitching to PRIVATE MESSAGING and we can get on with the discussion of this thread, which we all know one way or another is important.

 

Actually, I've been playing grenadier a lot the last 2 days. I had no problem whatsoever, even when good grenadiers such as Skie Dragon were on the other team. I fail to see the issue. If a rifleman is dug in, then I know to avoid him. He's anti infantry, I'm not. He should kill me, so I simply adapt my tactics, flank him, make him stand up for a sec and drop a mortar on him, then do it again. I don't see any of the issues you guys have with dig in except for mine clearance. That is the only problem I'm seeing with it. I'm sorry but no matter how much you want it, grenadier isn't anti infantry.

I mean hell, I took out a 2 rifleman by firing an RPG at the first one whilst he was stationary with dig in, he moves slightly with crouch but it wasn't enough and he died to it. Then I did it to the 2nd one, he got up and moved, at which point I pulled out my mortar and hit him. They aren't unbeatable, they just require you to think outside of the box, because YOU are anti-tank and THEY are anti-infantry.

IMO fix mine clearance and it's fine.

 

The thing is Trix, that currently the Grenadier kinda sucks against tanks when they got armor researched.

 

I essentially agree with Dubee. There's nothing wrong with the RPG that a little speed and turning increase, plus a small damage boon won't fix. Things that have already been coded in and are awaiting testing, we've already got the increased ammo in.

I haven't posted in a while, because I thought this part was over. But it seems to be coming around in the same circle again. I don't think we need homing, I think we just need better guiding. It's already coded, so let's try it. You may think homing would be useful if you don't play grenadier too much...but I can foresee a lot of problems with it. Currently, the grenadier isn't an underdog, he's just not quite perfect. It doesn't need a massive change to make him better, just a few small ones. And hey, homing missiles aren't more intuitive than guided. Most games with RPG's have guided, and being different isn't always a good reason to change.

 

I already gave meds and heavies negative resistances to rpgs. If need be smaller vehicles + armor can have some (few) too. Maybe when RPG values are scriptable something there will also change. I don't see gren versus tank as a problem anymore until there is a test-ready version.

 

I am entirely for better maneuvering. A hit would be much more satisfying if I controlled it than if it was because of automatic tracking. There's just something about nailing moving infantry with an RPG.

 

Aside from everything else, it is worth pointing out that this is a potential problem.

The grenadier is not, I think, supposed to be the TF2 soldier with a guided rocket launcher. The RPG shouldn't be a particularly powerful anti-infantry weapon -- it's all right if you can get occasional kills on people standing still, but IMHO if you end up with dedicated "grenadier-snipers" taking up key locations and focusing on picking off infantry with the RPG, then you have a problem.

Right now it isn't so much of a problem, because the RPG is slow and has virtually no radius and is, therefore, easy to dodge. If you make the RPG fast and give it a big radius, though, it will be a potentially game-altering anti-infantry weapon, and I don't think that that would be a good thing -- it would turn games into "grab key sniping location, RPG-snipe endlessly."

What I'm saying is, while it's fine for the RPG to sometimes get kills on infantry right now (when they can easily dodge), if it's sped up and given a blast radius to the point where infantry can't easily dodge, then it might be necessary to simply nerf the RPG's infantry damage completely.

I know people won't want to hear that. But near-infinite range fast-moving guided sniper rockets with a large blast radius are not something that the game's current infantry balance really needs. They'd be fine as purely anti-tank weapons, but if we go that route I think we might have to consider doing nearly no damage to infantry, just like they currently do nearly no damage to structures.

(It probably goes without saying, but one of the advantages I see to automatic homing is that I assume it would use the existing system and, therefore, simply wouldn't lock on infantry. It's fine for the RPG to get occasional infantry kills against inattentive players, but given its range I just don't think it can ever be allowed to become reliable at killing infantry.)

 

How does this compare with the lt/afv. Currently meds with reactive have around the same amount of plates as their lt/afv counterpart. You're saying that the meds with the same amount of plates will die faster than an lt/afv?

 

Yea, meds have more weight allowance than LT/AFV if they take the same amount of armor they have "below average" armor for their tank chassis (average for med is 3 plates) I could also go and say: Hey, 4 plate all around meds are too strong against rpg.

 

I am against research-bound RPG speed and missile control. Such stuff would only surprise players, in a bad way, and waste their ammo.

Buff damage and missile cruise speed, keep reload time and ammo loadout for Gren RPG.
That way, you can have several grends gang up on 1 tank, and either kill it, or expose one side of the armor enough for it to start caring.

 

I posted a suggestion a bit ago saying that RPG's would do hull damage, which would stop on field repairs. I really think this should be tested out, 10% hull damage to start out with and adjust it as we go. It would make grens worthwhile during a big tank fight and shit
link that im about to bump

 

Rpg

Dubee, is probably the best Gren. Scratch that He is the best Gren I have seen in Empires. I think he is right:

-Speed (Rocket)
-Maybe Lock (Homing) esp. since Kane agreed to code it. Just for a try at least.
-Better Guidance.
-Kick Like a F@#$%^& Howitzer!!!!!!! (Cheap bang, and easy animation)

ps: If guided not homing then, (just simple guided as is with better speed) Personally I would like a little more damage. Listen to Dubee though he the more experienced Gren.

pps: Where is Dee? She should have killed this thread when Kane agree'd to make changes? Commie right too the hull damage would obselete the need for more damage...my 2 cents...

:eek:

 

Why don't they add a tad bit more heat rather than just the amount they give with heat to damage modifier?

Overall, the RPG is slow, and while firing it accurately, it makes all but the most accomplished grens sitting targets to any and everything. Personally, I think it would be interesting to adjust the damage modifier to make RPG's do 125 hull damage, and make it always do 1 plate of armor to any armor.

Just take 125 and give it a damage multiplier that will make the damage equal to 1 plate of that armor.

That may be a tad bit low, but I think that a perfect gren v tank should end up taking a minimum of as many RPG shots as the tanks lowest amount of armor.

This in conjuction with backing up your own tanks by attacking from opposite sides to hit the enemy as he tries to turn his tank away, and then the gren's ability to see how many plates a tank has, it would make them damned near perfect, requiring a certain amount of skill to use correctly, but not being horribly overpowered just because you are skilled.

This also lets tanks maintain their superiority based upon what level of tech they are. But yeah, 1 plate would be a good starting damage for an RPG round. Maybe 1.5 plates.

 

I lol'd, ark can't make particles.