you didn't have to do this pre-2.41 because the buildings nearby and even your empty command vehicle would allow you to see enemy units from comm view. now they do not.
OK - lets see if I have this right. 1) Drop a camera, 2) Keep moving the COM vehicle. And you don't see the contradiction in that - right ? Gotcha - it's obvious this topic is dead and useless. Fuck this shit. Vinnie
Vinnie, The command vehicle will never have a D-Gun or D-Gun equivalent. From the design direction that empiresmod has been taking it can be deduced that the commander is being made to be even more dependent on the team for its survival.
D-Gun is appropriate for the Total Annihilation game - which was in direct competition with Command and Conquer. My point is that you don't add a player that ends the game, as has been done in Empires, and leave him with no protection. The game is designed to push your players to the front lines, and you say they should also protect the COM. Fucking Fail ! And this is considered to be a good design for this game ? Amazing game with an enormous flaw that is going unaddressed due to bullying from those who love to use it. I've always claimed the COM position is about supporting the players, not about the COM, he is supposed to coordinate and support. Not the be-all. When he dies it should be due to his team failing, not due to some one using a rush tactic and taking advantage of a weakness in the design of the game. C&C you couldn't do this - the COM was not on the map. Total Annihilation you did have a COM on the field. It is a bit closer to how Empires Mod works - and YOU COULDN'T capture the COM alone unless you wanted to suicide. When a COM died - he exploded like a nuclear bomb and you sure had better have cleared the whole map or the remaining players will win the game, since everyone attacking the COM dies. The coolest thing a COM could do that was abuse was to walk into the opponents base when the other COM was far away from base. Get destroyed - at which point he goes up like a nuclear bomb - he'd horde units and use them to take out the opponents remaining base and units. Then attack the opponents players and remaining buildings - winning the game. If two COM's attacked each other it was considered a stale-mate. My point which seems to be very unclear. No one designs a game where the COM has no protection except units that can ignore his calls for help. And makes it so easy to rush - EXCEPT for Empires Mod! Anyway - Empires Mod has been designed to require the most valuable player on the team, that when killed the whole team loses, to have nothing but thick armor which can obviously be destroyed quickly by more than three players. Grens are in some cases more powerful than medium tanks so right from the start of the game the COM is exposed. The COM vehicle can be easily pinned, or stuck in a ditch, walled or stunned, and made such that other players can with a small amount of coordination - destroy it. What a fucking waste of time this game has become. Play for an hour - win 90% of the map, jump out of vehicle to drop a camera in the COM's new location - hey it would be idiotic to sit still and not have a camera - ya right. Die and lose the game. Who the hell would want to COM under these conditions ? Anyway - I'll play on occasion - enjoy shitting on the other players. When you are clearly being out played - rush the COM. Guys in this thread think I'm complaining about Stacking and I AM NOT ! In all cases when this happens WE ARE WINNING, and in many cases with lesser players, but better research and coordination. I won't cheat. So they have the advantage using these cheating tactics. I've always said that once I play a game and find someone can cheat - that is the ONLY reason I would leave the game. I did this on Quake, Unreal Tournament and other games that have been hacked and I fucking loved those games and completely ruled on them. Instead of organizing a proper attack squad, stick to your sneak tactics and this game will just continue to flounder. I fucking wasted a couple years learning this. Fortunately I'm out flying planes now that weather has improved. If you want a real hobby that you can't cheat at - give this a try: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_petpvH0kU Burn out after burn out - finally made the ultimate highs speed motor http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5NxcDr_9wY Then evolved to high speed, high efficiency http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otc9hwqnHsM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwXdh0H2TtU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scg2-p0ukGo&list=FLT-j0lCwt5YMNjvzLhlACNg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hB1-eB0H8Zk http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=FLT-j0lCwt5YMNjvzLhlACNg&v=scg2-p0ukGo&feature=player_detailpage http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6ofjUHkolM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2dLnXFP87Q
You make it sound as if your team was oblivious to a squad of players going missing. Honestly, whenever I play, none of this BS happens and if the commander leaves the CV exposed it's his damn fault. I just can't imagine how it can be such q big problem as you turn it out to be. All the commanders I've played under recently had no such issues.
You keep talking about how Total Annihilation had protection for the commander in the form of the D-gun and his normal weapon. What about the fact that he could be picked up by enemy air transports and just taken away, waving his arms like he just don't care? Vidya: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPIvVQxLGgo#t=1m25s Good times. Also, I dunno how often this is happening to you, because this has not become an exceedingly common problem to me.
I just don't see it as a big problem, I'd be bored as hell as commander if I wasn't constantly worried about being turreted. On the occasions I do get caught out it is usually my own fault for staying in a vulnerable spot away from my team. If anyone can pull this off whilst I am parked infront of my forward VF inside a turret farm then hats off to them, they deserved to win.
Every time you post, all I can think of is "If you want Empires to change a fundamental gameplay element to be the same as all these other games, then go play those games". The Command Vehicle being both unable to directly defend itself yet being the most important entity in the game is a fundamental gameplay element. A team on the front can't risk letting some players get through, a commander can't risk letting his guard down, there's the constant risk of danger that the comm constantly needs to be looking for and the team needs to be ready to respond to. The fact that the comm is both important and vulnerable isn't a gameplay or balance issue, it's a design element. Which means it's never going to change unless the idea of what Empires is changes. And yes, this most definitely is a stacking issue. When's the last time you saw a group of players that weren't vets or highly skilled pubbers pulling off a ninja? A vast majority of the time it's a group of vets or highly skilled pubbers with maybe a standard pubber or two helping. It's vets that squad up and do ninja's or early-game rushes, not average players.
I kinda agree with Candles tbh. I played a lot of games where the CV actually contributed to teamwork without being detrimental, precisely because it was vulnerable. Though it's not really a perfect set up, it seems to work for the game. Actually the com can be likened to a manifestation of a construction yard or similar defenceless building, except that it also offers the god-view that players have in regular strategy games. That's how you put that kind of player into the game. Or am I wrong? You seem to be coming up against this tactic over and over again which doesn't happen to a lot of people, in my experience. I don't really understand how you can be so unlucky, since it's clear you're aware of both your vehicle and the rest of the battlefield at the same time. The rules of the game haven't changed in the last 6 years or so (that i've been around), so I don't really understand it. It just sounds like you're ranting because of another reason in your life. Or maybe because you've hit your limit with Empires for a while. This game tends to do that, since people tend to put their hearts into a round, and when a bad set of players strike, they ruin it. But you do really seem to only be talking about two things - APC rushes (regardless of a buffed weapon or because of it?) and scout lameness. APC rushes by default are a viable strategy, as is a rush in most strategy games, and the scout is getting looked at so it'll be harder for someone to just sit all match in one place and then win randomly. So...I dunno why you're so angry.
he's angry because i can organize 4 other people to overcome any non-player obstacle and take out a cv within 20 seconds or less. more times than he could stomach, i found a way to deal enough damage as was necessary to kill him before his team could rescue him. maybe you guys ought to try commanding more often. perhaps then the CV would stop getting nerfed so hard
You don't have to move the comm vehicle far. I'm talking about rolling it forward for a second. The movement of your CV will trigger any mines placed near you, sure. But it's not about that. The whole point is that being in FPS view for a few moments will give you a better overview of the area around you than being in the CV will. The quickly changed perspective will allow you to keep an eye on things better. I think you're kind of wrong here though. That's not Empires, nor has it ever been what Empires is about. If we wanted a situation like that, we'd have gone the Natural Selection route (I would suggest Nuclear Dawn and NS2 but they both came way after Empires) of having static commander positions. Empires isn't an FPS with an RTS element. It's a straight RTS/FPS with all the brutally unforgiving aspects of that. The commander doesn't support a team, the team supports the commander, because he is by nature, commanding them. I don't mean this in an assholeish way but, you need to think less about problems with the strategies, and more about solutions to counter them. Given the CV's current HP, if you take it against the kind of HP the CV has had in the past, it's probably about 70-80% of the maximum it has ever been at. To put it in comparison, the minimum (I guess 2.12 in my time at least) is around 50% of what the CV has now. Back then, people could get soloed by a single Grenadier with an 8-mine and mortar. But I use "people" pretty generally, because even as one of the best Euro ninjas in the game at the time (along with Sonecha and Omneh), there were still commanders we agreed were far harder to ninja. LordDz, Sodaen (Love Story), Opie, Headshotmaster and even yourself. Why? Because they dropped cameras and rolled the CV frequently. It was such a simple solution to the problem and the fact is, it worked, and it's such an easy thing to do. It's not some huge elaborate solution, it's just a case of having battlefield awareness and taking steps to improve that awareness via ingame mechanics, i.e. targets and cameras (and radars in those days before vehicles were spotted on minimap).
I read the title...I then realised who wrote the OP, decided not to read it and just laughed at his failness.
craig how is it a ddos in your sig? except for a gangbang maybe but then its considerably more "data". also its a shite firewall if it only filters inbound traffic, but thats going to far i assume? (i know its a joke and i actually find it funny too)
Back in old days, the difficulty of getting into enemy main is like 50 times easier than now. And...yap, Situational Awareness. Those who have good situational awareness usually are the ones that spent a lot of times outside CV, thus they are well awared of these tactics. Or maybe he's been ninja'd too many times that he's well awared of these tactics too. Either way, you have to be familiar with these tactics to actually counter it. I think one's comm ability doesn't have much to do with this. There's a lot of "Good comms, but they often lose their CV in stupid ways".
it was quite easy in 2.12 actually. you got nine mined once and you learned to pay attention. thats how it worked for me. before that i had my comm view hovering over the battlefield watching my dudes do stuff. i even tried funky angles. well then suddently it was over and i was wtf and then someone wrote "lol 9mine noob com" (which certainly was right at that time). after that i was paranoid as fuck for ages. always made sure i was inbetween 2 mgs and had a cam around when i went into comm view. i forgot about that when 9mine got removed, took me another one to realize it was back (i still remember the map, mvalley, it was in the north, cant recall who it was though - i also think it was a 6 mine or whatever number was required + rpg to end me flipped), yet nowerdays 9mining doenst bother me much anymore, its way less effective. in even games im actually only afraid of apcs, a bunch of good players in it, a slightly unresponsive team, or maybe only the wrong tone when you announce the rush and the game is over faster then you can say fuck. also a good "tip" if you spot a 9miner out of comm view. let him plant the first two or so and switch into drive mode :trollface:
Ah.. 2.12, the time were I was more paranoid about having friendly players near my cv than enemy players. Griefing, griefing, griefing.. Also, small tip for checking for ninja: Hold A and drag a box around you once in a while, will detect enemy players hiding in trees a lot easier.
