Script changes ----- Empires 2.11.0 "Devastation"

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by Sgt.Security, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    The ultimate solution is a new CV model.

    NF CV suffered a lot from its needlessly large size. You virtually don't have to aim to hit NF CV, that's totally not the case for BE CV.
    I have seen a lot of successful rushes against NF CV that would've failed if it was against BE CV.

    Even if I give NF CV 10000 hp, it doesn't matter at all when it comes to sudden death. NF CV is "at least" twice as likely to take any hit.

    CV is win condition, we can't apply asymmetry here.
    They should look different, but they shouldn't have different size, even handling.
    Okay, I explained quite a few times to lamer and others, this will be the last time.

    First, we did not receive enough votes to begin with.

    Second, 9 members voted for 85/105 damage(aka lower damage), 9 members voted for 150 damage(aka same damage).

    So, that vote is NOT decisive in any way.

    Why lower damage?
    Here, what's the role of a mine (for infantry) in Empires?

    What happens when you step on one?
    You die, instantly, there's no interaction whatsoever.

    It's not easy to notice a mine unless you invested hundreds of hours, and even after that hundreds of hours, you still step on mines regularly(just not always).

    This is mostly for new players because can you tell me how Empires would be fun for a new player who died to a mine for 5 times within 2 minutes?
    In Neutral Selection they have mines, but that's because those creatures can climb walls and easily evade the mines, for creatures that can't climb walls, they don't die to a single mine.


    Empires has a pretty high "player retention rate" when it comes to vets, but not new players, we have to fix this.

    My engine change does NOT target sticky stun, it does affect sticky stun.

    Sticky stun is being used against CV for 80% of the time, if I don't want to actually nerf sticky stun, I should keep that.

    There's no "not making any sense" in video game, we only need a good description.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2016
  2. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    I thought the engine change had more to do with plasma then anything. I also have the smallest of hopes of it bringing back overheating yourself, but I know that's one change that's never going to happen unless heat was completely retooled.

    I agree with exactly what security is saying, it affects how sticky's work against tanks but for the most part that isn't what people use them for, so it's not going to have the greatest of effects on normal tank combat.

    I can also tell you that the amount a tank can move if it only has that 5-15% throttle is enough to either keep it moving but slow it down a bit if it already has a lot of speed(I don't think I ever see a scout stun a tank moving full throttle in a direction), or basically just turn in place(very slowly I might add). It's not enough to actually move the vehicle from stop to even 10mph or 16kph in under 5 seconds. For frame of reference because I think most people either don't know or forgot, fission already has some power output while overheated, and security is going to give just half that minuscule power to other engines. It's a tad worse here now that I think about it because fission has more horsepower then the other engines, so it gets more from it. I'm certain once people actually experience the change most will say "oh, that's nothing at all really".
     
  3. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    thinking that one of the reasons that people are leaving is visible mines killing people in 1 hit is really dense thinking

    never once i have heard new players say mines are annoying. i've heard them say people are rude and not helpful., ive heard them say the game is ugly and boring. ive heard them say its confusing.

    you are changing mines because you dont like mines
    i think the nf cv is a little big but i still disagree with this
     
  4. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    Exactly.
    Have you wondered if
    "step on something that's virtually invisible (to them) and die instantly" is part of "Empires is boring"?

    Why do you think CV requires model-size asymmetry?
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2016
  5. Solokiller

    Solokiller Member

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    Encountering mines as infantry just plain sucks. Grenadiers should either be carrying anti infantry mines or anti tank mines, and imo anti infantry mines would still be too OP for them. They're supposed to be anti tank units, not anti infantry.
     
  6. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    thats funny. since i seem to remember it always doing this much damage?

    if you guys want more opinions, you can always see the old topic on removing mines from 2013. everyone was against it (except urethra frankinlin+spartacus). so many smart people/old vets with good reasons why lowering mine damage is dumb!
    https://forums.empiresmod.com/index...f-mines-everyone-hates-urethra-edition.17132/
    (for those that get to page 2. yes, it was the worst night)
     
  7. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    I was there.

    Mine should exist because of tactical reasons ( I 100% agree with this) =/= mine should 1-hit kill infantry.
     
  8. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    Strange that if you can't show definitive one way or the other on mines, you still opt to change it based on what you feel is right. I would think that if there is no reasoning one way or the other, you would just leave it alone.
     
  9. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    I didn't post that thread for no reason.
    Clearly, I think it's a problem.

    If I threw out my ideas and received 50% no, I will definitely implement that.
    60%? Cool.
    70~80%? That's something, I'll put it on hold then.

    First, I am not an elected official.
    I am here because of my experience and understanding of Empires.

    I am not here to blindly follow people(vet or not) before they said so, unless at least 70~80% of them are giving me the same opinion.
     
  10. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    So all is lost, because you just stated it doesn't matter what we think, you are going to do what you want no matter the consequences. Good luck on that. Funny, somehow I think more than 18 people play this game, and you make your decisions off one vote on some obscure post. Well, geez, how can anyone argue with such astute logic.
     
  11. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    Half the guys voted for 80/105 damage, are you going to outright ignore that as well?

    Because for some reason your 50% matters more? We are on the same boat, buddy.

    Also what consequences? Are you a prophet?
     
  12. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    Consequences are your own doing here, I am not the one that just claimed dictatorship over decisions that are best left out of the hands of us lowly mortals.
     
  13. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    And half thought the idea was stupid. So, what about those?
     
  14. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    Yeah well and nothing ever gets done, congrats.

    Did you play portal 2?
    Stalemate detected.

    Also I am still waiting for you to name me some issues that I actually created, if you have no faith in me then I am fairly sure you can come up with at least 20 of them, right?
     
  15. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    WTF does play portal 2 have to do with Empires, seriously, gotta come up with something better than that.
     
  16. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    Well, I don't have anything to prove, but what 20 things have you done to improve the game Oh great and powerful Oz.
     
  17. DocRabbit

    DocRabbit Member

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    Just a taste of what Empires armors could be.
    Code:
    "Absorbant"    //5
        {
            "Name"                "Absorbant"    //name given when selecting weapons
            "Description"            "Asborbant armour transfers the energy from taking damage into cooling the engine. It reduces the amount of damage it takes the faster the projectile that impacts it is going."    //description given when selecting weapons
            "Icon"                "vehicles/gui/armor/absorbant_sml"    //Path to the icon file used in the gui (uses an inferred path of the empires/materials/vgui/ folder)
            "Hud Icon"            ""    //not used
            "Size"                "1"    //Slot size, default is always 1
            "Type"                "0"    //Type of Vehicle that can use this armor: 0=all, 1=ground, 2=aircraft, 3=ship, 4=jeep, 5=light tank/afv, 6=med tank, 7=heavy tank, 8=artillery tank, 9=apc, 10=all tanks:light, medium, heavy and artillery, 11=Command Vehicle
            "Weight"            "12"    //The Weight of the Armor
            "Cost"                "5"    //The Cost of the Armor, per plate.
            "Research"            "Absorbant Armor"    //The Research Tree that will unlock this armor.
            "Health"            "65"    //The Health of 1 plate of armor.
            "Type"                "0"    //amount of health this armor regenerates per second. If set to same as bio damage, will nullify bio.
            "Angle Modifier"        "0"    //Determines how much angle of impact affects overall damage. 0 for none, 1 for totally based.
            "Speed To Damage Modifier"    "0"    //How Speed of weapon affects damage to armor.
            "Damage Modifier"        "1"    //Overall modifier of weapon damage. Can be used to affect damage no matter the source.
            "Damage To Heat Absorbed"    "-0.1"    //percentage of damage received which is added as heat (0.2: damage*0.2=heat added)
            "Bioweapon Damage Modifier"    "1"    //scale damage from biological weapons by this amount (bioweapon damage per interval * modifier = damage taken per interval)
            "Sound Impact"            ""    //Sound file used for Impact.(not used)
            "Sound Repair"            ""    //Sound file used for Repair.(not used)
            "GeneralPhysicsResist"        "0.5"    //Plasma Cannon and Plasma mg
            "KineticResist"            "0.75"    //Railguns, Standard Cannon, Ranged Cannon
            "ExplosiveResist"        "0.1"    //HE Cannon, Grenade Launcher, Upgraded Grenade Launcher
            "BulletResist"            "1"    //Standard, 50 cal, Chain mgs. aka Non Armor damaging
            "APBulletResist"        "0.5"    //Du and bio mgs. aka Armor Damaging
            "BulletExplosiveResist"        "0.125"    //HE mgs. aka Bullets that Explode
            "MissileResist"            "-0.2"    //Single, Upgraded, Homing, Guided, SalvoHoming, SalvoGuided Missile launchers. aka Generic Missle type of damage
            "MissileExplosiveResist"    "-0.2"    //Nukes
            "KineticArtResist"        "0.75"    //Ranged arty. aka Kinetic Artillery
            "ExplosiveArtResist"        "0.5"    //Small, Med, HE arty. aka Explosive Artillery
            "InfantrySeismicResist"        "0.95"    //Siesmic Grenades
            "InfantryBulletResist"        "1"    //Infantry guns
            "ExtraType1Resist"        "0.95"    //Building Collisions
            "InfantryMeleeResist"        "1"    //Infantry melee
            "InfantryMineResist"        "0"    //Player Tossed Mines
            "InfantryMissileResist"        "0.2"    //Grenadier Missiles
            "InfantryMortarResist"        "0.2"    //Grenadier Mortars
            "InfantryStickyResist"        "0.2"    //Riflemen Sticky Grenades
        }
     
  18. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    and this is what you said
    you said yourself that mines are easily avoidable. the fact that the excuse you say now is that new players cant avoid them and die instantly shows you either had some "epiphany" within the past 3 years of an unchanged game or you are choosing whatever excuse you think sounds most sympathetic to garner the most support.

    "mines that cant be avoided" you mean on maps like district?

    the reason you want to nerf mines is right there in that second sentence
     
  19. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    For me mines can be easily avoided.

    That's 3 years ago, unless you want me to bring that ego to my position.

    Now you have a problem with me not bringing ego to my position.

    Great, you guys are wonderful.
     
  20. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    no. you were not referring to yourself. the second sentence you use "we"
    "This is what we should deal with."
    even in the first sentence you use "they." if you were referring to yourself you wouldve said "i can easily avoid them"

    digging yourself a hole
     

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