Remove the scout because the grenadier is all you need to do commando missions.

Yes lets start a flamewa... discussion about that.

I say the grenadier has all you need.


Special explosive devices that can destroy a whole base at once (mines)

A hard to learn but very effective on hit kill weapon (mortar)

A grenadier with speed / melee / health and ammo upgrade is better than any scout for the role a scout is in the game.

And no spotting stuff is not a excuse to keep the scout in because tell me the
player that likes to sit one hour on a hill and spot targets...

 

Well, normally I wouldn't macro.. but in this case...

 

laming scouts are really a pain in the ass :mad:

 

You still didn't notice that 9th mine will be (is in 2.2) removed?

 

His ACTUAL point is that the scout is useless.

 

rofl.

That's not true, the scout has uses like......well....ya see....its can....emm......go partly invisible! 1/5 will never see you!

 

Well there was an idea that if scout spots enemy unit with some range then grenadier can target his mortar to scout's target. It would require 1 scout and at least 1 grenadier but targetting would be automatic. Just an idea.

 

Wouldn't that be a little hacking? Like giving a lot of random WTF kills?

 

Then don't stand still, and the best you can do with that is just some grazing splash damage, that doesn't even hurt you; would probably be used best against turrets and such...

Scout's not useless, before any good attack, a couple of scouts would move into the enemy base before the main force arrives, this is devestating...

 

we're trying to tie the scout into gameplay, not remove him

 

Give the scouts some satchel charges, remove the scout rifle; and call them "Commando"

 

As far as I´ve seen the scout, I would say he´s just a:
Gaytastic 60 minuteinvisiblealwaysonthesamepointsnipercamper.
That´s all.
Currently, in the average public game, everyone only uses the scout for sniping. (Why is the scout called a scout? Sniper would fit better.)
And for me, he´s not as useful as other classes. Shure, sabotaging a building is handy, but 1 engineer will notice it and repair it (and then kill you -> wasted time & ticket (take the time that is needed to get unseen into the enemy base into account)).

 

nothings wrong with the scout just people who dont know how to play as scout

 

How about just removing classes in general? Simply allow selecting of weapons/armor/abilities etc. to mix and match. Empires can be even more unique by not following the general trend of every FPS using the class system.

 

And then we have riflemen with build tools.

 

unique like cs

 

lol, keep the classes, though i like the link between scout and grenediar. Like the scout spotting co-ordinates, and, i dunno, letting the grenediar (in the artillery with the artillery feedback skill) lock onto the co-ordinates to make them land 80% accuratly. Then i could diffenetly see a use for scouts.

 

lol I actually agree with this guy..

They do need some visual upgrades and binocular improvements .. But I think they are good right now(very useful).. I'm not that great but I know some people who rape as a scout(dorito-lord's one) But I have actually tried it a couple times and had great success.. The last time I was a scout was on isle, I snuck into the enemy main with an smg2 and silencer skill.. Then I sabotaged the barracks and the other buildings and got easy kills until I ran out of ammo(pistol too).. I gimped them so badly that our afv's were able to roll in and end it. :D GG

 

A scout and nader combo would be awesome!

 

I like spotting and would like to see it improved. Scout + mortar should be devastating... but it just doesn't get enough use right now, for several reasons.

One problem is that the scout has to manually tag each individual person to show them on the map. If the grenadier could see where concentrations of enemy troops are, they could do massive damage with the mortar... but that isn't likely when the scout only reveals a few of them.

Also, cameras and radars take away from the scout's usefulness. Solution: Take cameras and radars away from the engineer and give them to the scout. Of course, scouts have no tools, so they'd have to be dropped fully-built...

What about giving the scout some sort of thrown 'IR scanner' device or something, which is thrown like a sticky grenade? They throw it, it acts as a temporary camera + radar from the point where it lands. They could even throw it onto an enemy tank, which would constantly reveal both the tank and everything around it. I really like this idea, actually...

The closest thing I can think of to our scout is Enemy Territory's Covert Op; like the scout, they had scoped rifles, but that wasn't supposed to be their main purpose. Like the scout, they had binoculars that could be used to reveal things, and smoke bombs intended for tactical purposes.

Thinking back, one of the main things that kept them useful was their ability to steal enemy uniforms and use them for 'scripted' things in maps -- mainly, opening locked doors, which was always fun. Obviously that can't apply in Empires, though...

They also had the ability to reveal mines using their binoculars. That could be a useful thing in Empires, too... make it so if they hold the button while focusing on mines using their binoculars, the mines get highlighted and become easier for everyone to see. Perhaps even put them on the map. Not a huge advantage, since our mines can be seen visually anyway, but useful as a warning... especially since, with 9-mining removed, mines are more likely to be used for their intended purpose again, and scattered as defense.

Of course, then there's the satchel charge, which frequently gets suggested for the Empires scout. The problem is that its usage in ET was for scripted events. If we just give an Empires scout a satchel mindlessly, are they going to be able to use it on buildings? That could be bad. I don't think a scout should be able to sneak in and blow up the barracks all on their own.

Suggestion: Give the scout a satchel charge, but they only get one before they have to reload. Set its damage to buildings low enough so that, when combined with sabotage, it can kill an armory, turret, or camera, nothing bigger. Maybe let it destroy a segment of wall, but only one, and they can't carry more even with ammo upgrade.

This would make the satchel's usage more of a 'cunning' thing rather than a run-in-and-blow-things-up thing. Scouts could use it to soften up enemy defenses or open a vital breach, but other classes would be required for the actual 'stab', and it would require some thought / planning since you only get one before you have to go reload. I think that this is appropriate to the theme of the class.

It could also be designed so it can destroy scripted brushes / constructable brushes, if map designers want to work with that.

No meaningful damage to tanks. Scouts aren't an anti-tank class. Perhaps it could do a bit of damage, as a roadside bomb for softening tanks up... but it wouldn't do enough to kill even an unarmored tank on its own.

Ooo! Idea! If 9-mining is removed, maybe the scout's satchel charge could be used as a trigger for a grenadier minefield. I like the idea of the two working together to set up a trap like that... and requiring scout + grenadier for ninjaing makes a lot more sense to me than just having a grenadier do it.

(It could be used like mad when there's an engineer box nearby, which is perhaps a problem -- although an engineer next to a box can already do so much damage with their grenades that this isn't likely to be a big deal, especially since the satchel would have 0 range. If it's a problem, though, there could be a cooldown time between satchel uses.)

Just some brainstorming. Really, the 'sticky camera/radar' seems like the best idea to me... although I don't know if it would be enough. I love the idea of throwing one onto an enemy tank and having it act as a mobile scout for my team without its driver knowing.

Regarding using sabotage to halve a building's HP, something the scout does now: I agree that this helps a lot, but honestly... most of the time, if you're at the point where your team is doing 50% damage to an important building, you've already won anyway. The scout's role there is more of a "win more" ability, rather than one that (usually) turns the game around. It's not a bad thing, certainly, and it can be useful, but I'm not sure that it gives the scout enough of an all-around role at the moment.

Also, make the scout's default weapon an SMG rather than its rifle. This would discourage people from viewing it as just 'the sniper'.