Discussion in 'Art' started by Marshall Mash, Dec 21, 2010.
you said that on the stingray too, remember ;P
The Empires' forum is full of contradictory statements.
Those are MG barrels that launch missiles because whoever added missile launchers to the scripts was having a derp moment.
If you were to make things accurate to the models, BE tanks would only have cannons while NF tanks would have only cannons and MGs, with the NF heavy strangely having two MGs.
"Is reminded of AFV horrors" AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
You don't fucking get to decide that, everybody wants that.
Who the hell do you think you are? this is a fucking democratic community you don't decide everything.
Mash if you can get a model working for the NF APC with a second seat turret, we'll find a way to implement that in Empires, dont let mootant decide for us, just ignore him.
well i have to agree with the rollbars, though most use the models without them anyway.
but there really is little reason for having the nfapc without a hatch seat mootant (except for the 4 seated jeep, but i dont think it fully justifies this imbalance)
I'd like to see jeeps made equal, because on many maps (probably a lot of them tbh) NF can rush a vf and fire out a few jeeps to take map control, where BE would have to make twice as many, which basically makes the vf rush useless for BE.
jeeps need new models in general, not just roll bars removed. Seriously they look rediculous, they're a totally dumb design, and they're great to get stuck
Yeah I've to agree, only 2 on the 4 seats of a NF jeeps should be usable.
or the other way around, BE should get 4 seats or maybe they can use that flat thing on the back as some utility (camera, ammoz, turrent).
He's the only one coding and no it isn't. Democracy is something you are granted, you don't get it by default.
Yes mootant is a terrible designer, yes he shouldn't be making any sort of design decision because he ruins everything he touches, but there isn't really anything you can do about it.
He's the only coder. By all means, learn C++ better than him, commit more time than him, and take his position and do things your way.
Empires was never democratic. It also never had symmetric features:
- NF LT vs BE AFV
- NF RPG vs BE RPG
- shot pistol vs machine/burst
- NF HR vs BE HR
- NF jeep vs BE jeep (rollbar vs seats)
- NF med vs BE med
- NF rax vs BE rax
Megel had a better NF (I think) jeep. It was unfinished but we still didn't get it from him. I don't have any problems with it but as long as you're improving current one keep basic design.
All changed models should have separate threads in dev section or in dev bug tracker for progress tracking.
Some asymmetrical balancing is cool, but some is just faggy. Going through your example:
NF LT vs BE AFV - This was a shitfest for so long, but it's finally starting to come decent. The problem was mainly that LTs could slam into AFVs, but because of some bug, they can't do that any more, so it isn't such a problem.
Canyon - Not really asymmetrical anymore.
NF RPG vs BE RPG - Pointless change to the BE one which makes it 100x more difficult to use. Considering LTs are hard to hit as it is, it makes no sense. It isn't balance, it's just unfun.
Shotgun pistol vs BE pistol 2 - A really good example of nice asymmetrical balance. Both are used in different ways, but are very fun.
NF HR vs BE HR - Considering they're different roles, I'll assume you mean BEAR. And yeah, this is a problem because it's a fucking nightmare to make the NFHR just as good as the BEAR, without making it way better. But if we ever do manage to balance it, then it'll be another nice bit of balance.
NF jeep vs BE jeep - The extra seats make a difference, and it's faggy that BE don't have them. But the BE jeep doesn't need extra seats. It could have anything extra, a mounted MG, inbuilt ammo/hp box, etc. But this doesn't make up for the seriously homo rollbars which just make it plain unfun to drive.
NF med vs BE med - Honestly, I like this. It works well imo. People hate on the NF med, but I defy you to get that tank stuck. It will go fucking anywhere. And the BE one is without a doubt harder to drive at higher speeds.
NF rax vs BE rax - This was a problem until rocket sniping was basically removed. Since then, no issues.
So in other words, asymmetrical balancing works sometimes, but others it's just plain unfun. Blocking your visibility is not balance, it's just gay and unfun. Not having a key aspect of the game (teamwork) in a vehicle (NF APC) is also really unfun. Balance based on how well it can accomplish a job, not removing the ability to do it at all.
Mash: Ignoring MOOtant for the time being, just try out some different hatch concepts on the NF APC. Same with your other new ideas. Just literally do 5 3D sketches of changes, and post up.
Fuck coding, all you've been doing is making Empires worse. This is not helping the community in any way.
We dont need developpers anymore, the game isn't going to be more than it actually is and all you guys are doing is ruining what some great developpers have did, so stop your bullshit right now!
hell of a pessimist we do have here
if you dont want it and cant add constructive critisism
save yourself an earlier client and server version and play it
nobody pushes you to update
im curious how many people gonna join you
Listing what I did wrong is perfectly fine but people using ad personam and derailing will be banned. Thank you.
Honestly, I think that's the most polite sentence I've ever heard MOOtant come out with. You should actually feel quite honoured.
Yeah I'll get banned for saying what everyone thinks, so be it.
What you or the dev team did wrong?
Removing targets without adding listenning posts, which results in building spotting infantry, that is completly rediculous you can't sneak in bases anymore!
No beta test for the updates, now unstuck isn't working anymore 90% of the time we get stuck and die because of it.
Soft Colission, this is fucking ridiculously stupid, nothing else to say.
Infantry Balancing, this isn't that bad but now we get killed in 2 bullets this is kind of boring. Althought it's not such a big deal and can be easily fixed anytime.
There's more, just didnt come to my mind yet.
In personam, ad hominem, it's all the same to me.
Separate names with a comma.