infantry "pick up" revive

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by OuNin, Mar 7, 2015.

  1. Paradox

    Paradox I am a gigantic asshole who loses people's hard wo

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    The repeatedly killing what ever came at you doesnt happen unless u playing a high pop game with multiple revive engies. And then going for the engi has almost no use cause the other engies will pick him up. The scenario Im talking about is theres a small squad say 3 people with 1 rev engi in it. You obviously dont know if theres more help on the way or not and id rather take out who ever I can see at that moment then put myself out there and trying to get the engineer. Taking unnescesary risks just to take out an engi isn't worth it in the long run imho.
     
  2. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    i dont really even how often ive seen whole bases being cleared by 3 guys just because everyone was too dumb to push back.
    so yes, unless im completely on my own, i try to flank and widen the angles to be able to get the engi. and thats all you can do really. if their revengi dropped a wall and supports their gren hugging the ammo box, the only other option left are vehicles - which sometimes are no option at all bc you either ran out of res bc ppl just lost tank after tank or it simply is too early for that.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2015
  3. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Healing is actually very powerful but our playerbase has ADD and refuses to stand still for 2 seconds to go back up to full for a fraction of revive's cost. If people slow down a bit, they'll get much more resupply benefit.
     
  4. Ikalx

    Ikalx Member

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    The crazy thing is, the current dev team seem surprisingly open to all the old ideas that got shot down long ago.

    It's about as big a change, to be honest. I still think scouts and riflemen should have a slightly more effective way to combat tanks (but in their own way, like engies have turrets and walls).

    To be honest, I like the medkit idea, but let's think about it for a moment. If we removed revive from the game, and just thought about the impact a one-shot medkit (for everyone) would have on the game, that's a big difference. I think it's probably a good difference, but if you wanted to keep that kind of mechanic you'd have to have something different for the engineer. Something like, instead of revive, he would have a medkit that had a cooldown. Or maybe if we added medkits to the ammo crate (or a new healthcrate thing), but they still had a 1 minute cooldown on their use.

    It's a difficult thing to get right. Changing revive makes me think first about infantry maps (which we shouldn't really take into consideration), and first contact situations like mvalley's north, or canyon's east and west fronts. What we most want is an ability that works really well for that without messing things up.
     
  5. Paradox

    Paradox I am a gigantic asshole who loses people's hard wo

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    Standing still 2 seconds gets you killed and communicating to the person that has to be healed to get killed all takes time. Whilst reviving gives all the power to the revive engi, you see a dead person and you choose when to go and when not to.

    Healing requires 2 people to communicate to stand still and be static in the middle of a fight -> no fucking go boys.
     
  6. Tama

    Tama Developer Staff Member Web Developer

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    Sounds like a great idea. I think it could be quite simply: e-revive always brings you back with 10 hp. Perhaps engineers shouldn't have revive anymore then? I mean, they still have squad revive, and are generally overpowered in Empires, so I think it would pan out fine.

    As for the gap between infantry and tanks... simple; infantry upgrade researches, such as better mines, rockets and stickies. (also, stickies should have about twice the range they currently do)
     
  7. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    >implying people hand out heals when bullets fly at them
     
  8. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    but but squad heal.
     
  9. Metruption

    Metruption Member

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    would be so strong with the changes?
     
  10. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Squad heal works too!
     
  11. Paradox

    Paradox I am a gigantic asshole who loses people's hard wo

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    whats the point of healing people if bullets arent flying? Healing is more efficient on calculator charge and you dont need heals if bullets aint flying.

    If there arent bullets flying and you need heals you fucking kill yourself for more points.
     
  12. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    there should be "fucking stop running around like a headless chicken you bloody coward i try to heal you for minutes already" and "dont respawn i have revive" voice commands in the f-menu.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2015
  13. f1r3w4rr10r

    f1r3w4rr10r Modeler

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    look at Killing Floor for reference. ;P
     
  14. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    The frontline is complex enough to allow for two people to be safe for the few seconds it takes to hea you. I'd demonstrate what I mean (I'm fully aware that what I wrote is hardly convincing) but I don't have the hardware or players.
     
  15. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    i dont even know how often i died because i tried to heal someone who couldnt stop running around - yes its partially also my fault i should have stopped chasing them with the calculator out.
    and those who look at you when you heal them? fucking give cover :facepalm:

    how many take heal upgrade on district? it puts a friendly back to 130 in no time at a much lower cost then revive does. but noone is used to heals so noone waits for heals so you just waste a skill and die because noone stands still.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2015
  16. ViroMan

    ViroMan Black Hole (*sniff*) Bully

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    There should be some fucking indication that someone is trying to heal you... some fucking green +'s show up on the side the team mate is healing you from. The same as a damage indicator.
     
  17. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    I have to agree with ddd about finding cover for secs on the frontline. The very few times I actually played support engy healing people and dropping walls so I could heal them safely helped a lot. Was worth more then simply reving people, can't do 100 things at once if you spam revs. Or you do that fun thing where someone sits ever so slightly out of cover to shoot people and they stay invincible because you keep healing them.

    I would take heal upgrade on district if there's competent rifleman or grens on my team, but usually I have to do a fair amount of shooting so I grab accuracy upgrade instead.

    Viroman's suggestion holds a lot of appeal actually. Though I do wonder if some people might mistake it as bio damage.
     
  18. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    damage would be minuses ofc ... ^^
     
  19. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    just that we had that and it didnt work out. heavies are still better in any shape or form so why research it.
    and if you make it useful you run into a whole phalanx of other balancing problems, especially when rushed and applied to 4 seated jeeps.
     
  20. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    You can make just heavies, or any tank specifically, have weakness/strengths against any resist type, including infantry weapons like rpgs. So you could effectively have increased rpg damage to just heavy tanks without messing with the balance of the other tanks. Honestly I feel rpgs are fine against lights/apcs and meds if the tank driver isn't great. Like every one says though it can feel like a grind to even remove plates from one side, let alone actually killing a heavy tank.
     

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