And what if your commander was preparing an epic tank rush on the nf enemy battlements, but just because you do not give a heartbeat for anyone's enjoyment (and got behind enemy lines) other then yours you decide to ninemine the nf command vehicle and make it explode just when your teams tanks come in range of the enemy front? i know i would be upset at the ninja, and i consider it griefing griefing: taking enjoyment from ruining and thus ending the game at the cost of everyone's enjoyment ninja-ing: taking enjoyment from ending and thus ruining the game at the cost of everyone's enjoyment the differences are so subtle in my eyes that they can be ignored
But the whole objective in empires is to kill the enemy cv. If you manages to get to the enemy cv, are you then doing something wrong by atacking it? Furthermore ninjaing is WAY easier to counter than griefing. Set up 2 mg turrets at the cv and your done. Ninjaing encourages to protect the cv, and no matter how annyoing it is, you have noone but yourself to blame for letting a grenadier slip straight past your defence. Griefing on the other hand is much harder to counter. Yes, ou can vote the griefer out of the cv but in most situations i find my team to ignorant to even notice that the cv's been jacked. So ninjaing is part of the gameplay ( to some extent ), killing the primary target, while griefing is the opposite of the intended gameplay, to kill the target that you are supposed to defend.
Now, is sneaking into the enemy base as a scout and sabbing all of their buildings and taking out all their infantry as they came out of the rax, and pinning them down to the point that they are useless... Is that considered ninjaing? or is it just attacks on the comm?
If you single handely manages to own the whole enemy base/team then no, that would not be ninjaing. Ninjaing is to avoid enemy troops to take out a high priority target by yourself, usually a target that is supposed to be a team effort to take out. (My defination of ninjaing)
Ninja = one man efforts that are result in above average results I usually associate ninjas with single rail tank rushs, DU apc rushs, gren nine mines, jeep rushs, etc. 2 MG turrets are ok, but holding back turrets and creating a small turret farm early game is almost untouchable. You can't really call a late game tank war defeat, when someone breaks through the lines, a ninja, it was bound to happen to either team eventually. and being ninja is only in context to what you're ninjaing, 'ninja the comm', 'ninja a base', 'ninja your mom', etc
A turret or a comm that pays attention (and thus runs the gren over) counters ninjas, nothing can counter griefing if someone gets in and drives it into a lake. Ninjaing has a fairly decent fail rate too, the comm often lands upright, but griefing is usually game over.
First thing you need to do empty, is define what a ninja is. Second thing, you must define what a griefer is. Third, you need to stop whining about it in the gameplay forums just cause you can. Post in one of the other 10000 threads that has had this topic argued.
One is ending a game using - albeit retard - legitimate tactics. The other abuses parts of the game and ends it illegitimately. Also ninjas are preventable and on the other team, whereas griefers are much more difficult to detect and preventing against them always would be very difficult (ie never leaving the cv when anyone was around). How is this even a thread.
I dont like ninjaing cause it destroys the fun for everyone else, its the same as if you drown the cv.
With 9 mine being removed the most used tactic to ninja is gone, though we can't balance the game based on one-man-armies that take out the CV, so we can't completely eliminate ninjas without changing/removing the fun parts of classes.
Ninja: To sneak around/behind/through enemy defenses to kill the enemy com vehicle. Grief: To prevent your own team from being able to play the map effectively. IE Walling in the VF, Stealing the com, flipping the com, walling in the barracks, etc. If the com is too lazy to put down ***2*** turrets NEAR him, then he deserves to be ninjaed. If he's too dumb to stay NEAR a barracks, he deserves to be killed by a scout then ninjaed. by scout stickies. Honestly, junk rushes (crap apcs and paper lights) end more games prematurely than anything else. Ninjaing only pisses you off because you are either the com, or you are winning. There is little point to ninjaing the enemy com if you aren't losing. you might as well drive a fricken heavy tank in to kill it. or an APC full of rofflemen. If you are truly concerned about getting blown to hell with mines, here's a neat little tip: Stop being an Engi com and start being a Gren/defusal com. With the new update especially, this will prevent you from being ninjaed. completely.
Yeah if you ignore the whole thing where the comm gets a message and the entire team can see the building blinking.
Sometimes our focus is more on our team who are fighting int he enemy base and need targets and orders, when do most ninjas occur? When your entire team is attacking the enemy base and you're preoccupied with keeping them informed.
From the point of view of one of the most notorious ninjas in the empires community (38 CVs, i have been counting), i decree ninjaing as punishment of the enemy team's plain FAIL. Here is the process of ninjaing a comm. Start at barracks at the front lines, where shooting is costant and lethal (hey, dont say you have never camped a enemy barracks with an assault rifle). Then you have to load up somewhere, which takes about 30 seconds. Then, you have to sneak past their ENTIRE TEAM, the inevitable turret farm, and walk through the lines to arrive at the enemy base where their comm invariably is. To this point, if you let a person sneak past your entire team, you ALREADY deserve to fail. Then, half of the time, i have to wreck some turrets so that they dont my day up as i am placing these mines. There should be turret under attack omg signals flashing in the comm's view and a flashing white square beside him. If he does not take the hint then, he is... kinda retarded. Then, it takes about 30 seconds to unload the mines. Most of the time beside the enemy barracks. More than once someone spawned, looked at me... and walked to the vf to get a tank. AFTER all that, i set off the ninemine, and mowtar+ rocket the weak side of the cv until it dies. He usually has about 5 seconds from the detonation to death: more than enough time to run away. But if the 'command vehicle under attack' message does not feature in his mundane consciousness, he DESERVED to die. I also made a point to never ninja in servers that is less than 9 players per team: it is almost impossible to stop a ninja below that, and i respect that fact. And i almost always have my comm and/or my squad helping by marking targets, squad hide, heal, etc. If your team could not kill one non-stealthy person (he is a gren, for god's sake) walking into your base, well... i dont know what to say.
LOL 38 kills mean nothing. It's not that hard at all to ninja with most comms you see these days. Point is, I know when I should or shouldn't ninja. It being easy is the biggest point to not ninja. I can't believe how many people think that if they can sneak in the base, the comm deserves to fail. If you think it's hard enough to detect someone sneaking in now on such a big map, wait for the airplane size maps. That's a very stupid excuse for a game that has a huge map and when the commander is busy doing what he is supposed to do, command his team. And the turret deals doesn't really work. They will either get taken out(or the comm will move when he sees the grenadier and eventually get caught in a bad position), or it's a comm who constatnly moves. Then you are forcing comms with tactics to always relocate to force down turrets everywhere they go because you want to have fun ending the game with no skill based off anyone else on your team. Why even have a game based off of team work if you want to go end games on your own? There is no excuse for having ninjaing with 9 mines in other then for yourself to have fun.
