I have noticed that there is room for some needed changes/additions... #Upgrades for Jeep Standard Jeep > Light Armored Jeep > Heavy Armored Jeep Light Armored Jeep(level 2): - option to add plates, two layers on front and single layer on sides and rear * or single layer on all sides - two infrantry units in rear are fully protected while driver and co-driver are exposed - unarmed - 25% more hit points than standard jeep - 10% slower than standard jeep with same engine - twice the price of standard jeep initial cost(w/0 armor) - not available from start(needs to be researched) With extra protection and higher durability as a replacement for standard jeep when further in the match for better survivability when a standard jeep would/will be destroyed in a single shot in comparison light armored jeep with single armor plates on all sides. Heavy Armored Jeep(IMV/Level 3): - option to add plates, three layers on front and two layers on sides and rear * or two layer on all sides - all infrantry protected - unarmed * or armed with turret that has machine gun and rocket launcher * or with cannon(75-90 mm) and maybe with rocket launcher - 50% more hit points than standard jeep - 25% slower than standard jeep with same engine - two and a half times the price of standard jeep initial cost(w/o armor) * or three to four times if its armed In similar fashion to light armored jeep with crucial difference being that crew is fully protected, it can be way more up-armored than light armored jeep while standard jeep in comparison has no protection and has "paper-thin" armor. A cheaper alternative to APC when lacking resources or is simply a cheaper alternative, specially if armed. #Variants for APC's Unarmed APC(MRAP?): - Unarmed(w/o turret) - one more layer of armor plates availabe compared to standard APC on front and sides * or one or two more infrantry can be inside vehicle compared to standard APC - 10-15% faster than standard APC with same engine - 20-25% cheaper than standard APC Cheaper alternative to standard APC involving transportation and spawning, option for team and/or commander that don't use APC in combat/assault and want to save resources for something else. Unarmed Assistant Commander APC: - one more layer of armor plates available on all sides - twice the hit points as standard APC - 10% slower than standard APC - twice the price of standard APC - only single unit can be produced - Assistant Commander: Assists in commanding troops and building refineries * maybe UAC-APC should look like command vehicle(?) to be used as a decoy. #CO-OP Vehicle Use There are a lot of time when not everyone can afford to control a AFV or tanks... Thus... Why not have one player controling movement of the vehicle while other the turret? Teamwork? It could be used as alternative in case of those days when there are dozens of players on the server. That is all for now... I have a lot more suggestions to make!
There is a sort of jeep upgrade already in the "works" it has a MG mount on it for second/third seat to use.
In the scripts there's no real way to affect max speed for a different types of the same chassis, as in jeep 1 goes slower then jeep 2. You can mess with horsepower, which affects acceleration and hill climbing, but that is almost always a terrible idea to see a real difference. Jeeps used to have armor, it wasn't a good thing. I doubt that cost is going to be much cheaper, most of the cost of a vehicle is in the armor and weapons. You'd save maybe 100 res for something that doesn't work as well as a afv or apc. Really sounds like afv. Shoving a couple more people in a apc is something that will never been seen or needed really. You'd have that apc you describe by simply not putting a weapon on it, even better it would fit exactly what you said if you limited yourself to just 2 plates a side with the bonus of not being any slower. Remember the base cost of an apc is just 100 res, that other 300 res you see is from armor and weapons like I previously mentioned. Light tanks too are only like 100 res, afv 150 res, for just the chassis. Assistant commander is kinda novel but honestly it's more for the idea of having a decoy. I'd like decoy command vehicles, that'd be kinda neat. It's not terrible hard for commander to drop a ref, I don't see it getting much use really. I guess costs could be rebalanced so most of the cost is on the chassis again so economic research is more of a thing, but that doesn't feel like a grand idea to me.
I really wish we had gunner seats in tanks, not only would that make the required amount of tanks lower, it'd also given more feel to the teamplay. That's one of the things I like about BF, gunner seats, you wanna play with your friend you get him in the turret. Multicrew ships in Star Citizen too. I've gotta say I wouldn't mind an actual APC as opposed to what we have which is actually an IFV (APCs dont have That however is, I'm sorry to say, a terrible idea. I have had a few experiences with 1 driving and other shooting in different games, and it's just horrible, even if you're on "real-time" voice chats like TS3 or skype (keep in mind in-game voice has some lag) it's VERY hard to coordinate well enough to accomplish anything.
For medium/heavy tank, chassis cost is 45~65% of vehicle cost. That'll go lower(30%~55%) because I am dropping chassis cost and Reflective/Compo/Capacitive will cost 20.
His suggestion is for apcs and jeeps, chassis cost is like 25-35% or something. Also nf meds only cost 200 res, its like 30% of the cost.
oh the glorious times of compo jeeps ... ... not. jeeps are fast, cheap transports so you dont need to run. they shouldn't be more. a random roadkill is ok, but "suboptimal" hitboxes (and unpredictedness of vehicles) make them the best anti infantry - and thanks to super "awesome" vehicle "physics" also anti tank - weapon. jeeps have been a lot better, theres reasons and things.
Oh... Like buggy from Battlefield 2? :D Okay, then at least adding armor plates on the LAJ and HAJ would make them noticeable and considerably slower in case of HAJ when fully armored... There is a difference between an IMV and AFV... LAJ is simply a more rugged/sturdy jeep and you would have to research it. HAJ first unarmed and second configuration is an IMV with second having capability IFV and some way to respond in case it enconters other armored vehicles while Tthird configuration is an AFV. Jeeps have much smaller profile, harder to spot and hit... Have there been days with 20+ people on each team last year? Okay, I understand your what you're saying and your view. Honestly, chassis cost should be higher to be more grounde with reality.
I understand why you regard the APC as an IFV, but to me it doesn't feel that way. I would like to have a bulkier slower vehicle armed with a 20-25mm autocannon, mgs, and anti tank missiles(probably one-slot ones). They would be more effective against infantry and provide much better support to tanks with lower cost. This of course would increase vehicle variety in the field, which is nice. Heavy battles are not as exciting as Empires battles could be.
Good point, I guess it's in-between APC and IFV. Let's just agree that we could use more vehicles, of any kind. I don't know about large tank battles not being exciting, I usually really into the game when it's higher than 16vs16, be it as commander or squad member. I think you're thinking too much about chokepoint maps. Anyhow I can't think of any game that has better vehicle fights than Empires. Can you?
World Of Tanks tops it... Disabling tracks, knocking out engines, killing crew when armor penetrated, etc... APC in this game doesn't feel like in IFV to me, it has bigger guns yet it takes time to kill single infantry. My suggestion of HAJ with second configuration is like an IMV-IFV...
Yes, I was thinking about Canyon's western chokepoint lol. I do not know any game that has better vehicle fighting at this scale, but I know that Garry's Mod has better vehicle and weapon addons. Like, a single modder has put more effort in his vehicle that the entire team has put in their game. Things are half completed imo, in the sense that things can be improved much more and we should not settle for its current state. You might say we do not have the manpower to get the job done, that's because the team is incomplete. I'm not aware of anyone responsible for "Public Relations". It's just a mod, but truth is things work like a business, except no mony or shiny golden coins. I've played War Thunder, I do not know about World of Tanks, but I've heard people who tried War Thunder after WoT were more satisfied.
If we gana talk about IFVs lets talk about C&C IFVs. The C&C IFVs take on the characteristics of the unit that enters it. THAT would be kinda cool for a vehicle for us. Repair/build tank one second, mortar/ML tank the next, then a DUMG tank the next, or ... I duno what it could be for the scout.
Weight doesn't affect speed at all, so that wouldn't do anything either. There's a parameter to affect horsepower but it doesn't work exactly right and horse power is a terrible thing to play with anyway. Most of my comment was thinking mostly about the heavy jeep you mention. For some reason I expected the model to somewhat bulk up, considering it has armor and weapons now, but anyways shoving a rocket launcher doesn't quite work, it's a problem where you move faster then the projectile and end up running into the shot you just fired. I guess it could have a custom weapon that was much faster, like some micro uml or something. But anyways, the real problem is I wouldn't expect any commander to go out of their way for this when heavies can still kill them pretty fast. Even if it's almost an upgrade of a light tank it isn't like lights fair at all in late game, which means all the extra res to put on armor and weapons makes this a giant money sink, an even worse investment then arty tanks. I guess it's more of a early game investment, but it sounds like a terrible investment in my opinion. Lights are already pretty cheap, and this just delays much more useful meds or heavies. This is more of a problem with research times, it takes no time at all to get heavy tanks, be has the easier research to rush heavies with and can get them at like 21 minutes or something. Really if heavy tanks and to an extent meds couldn't be gotten so fast little research things like this might have some room to exist, but currently there just isn't much purpose. Who actually gets shot in a jeep anyway? have you ever try to shoot out the driver in a jeep? Chances are you ran out of ammo before he died, chances are better he just ran you over instead. Decoy cvs still sound real nifty to me though, a very excellent late game research that can only be built through the commander's vf menu, which means only he gets to decide if he needs to pull a disappearing act and leave a decoy before he leaves.
Did I only suggest a rocket launcher for the HAJ? No. Please read again... If you can't see it then read it again and again and again until you found all HAJ configurations... I have a feeling that you didn't read my suggestion at all... HAJ is IMV in its essence, it could also be an armored car like the Eland with 90 mm cannon capable of destroying medium/heavy tanks. First suggestion for armed HAJ is against infrantry with rocket launcher being against opposing armored vehicles with punch being equal to that of grenadier's rocket launcher while second armed HAJ iteration is dedicated very mobile vehicle hunter while maybe a third possible variant should be mortar variant as mobile mortar. ...and it did happen. Implementing a decoy is probably a piece of cake, reuse the same model and only have driving portion of CV...
Implementing a fake cv is easy. It would take about 30 seconds to do in just the scripts. The tricky part is making it so not everyone can build one, because I don't think that's a good idea. What happened? There's 4 things that could have happened in my sentence. I gave the missile a mention because you mention in both weapon loadouts. If it's bringing 50% of the firepower, or maybe 100% of the firepower in the first case, it better be working or else it's just frustrating to use. I've seen you play this game. I'm not sure how you can make serious suggestions like that. You probably missed a period where we had mk2 light tanks. The big thing about them was it gave a 2 slot weapon on a light tank, 2 slot ml for nf and 2 slot cannon for be. It ended up being unliked mostly because the ultra mobility a light tank had vs heavier chassis meant they could take out these big expensive tanks. Giving jeeps of all things something with 2 slot firepower is just silly. Especially when you consider how fast jeeps are, it just doesn't work. 90mm cannon or any mm weapon doesn't mean much in empires, we don't have fancy tank damage and quasi realistic ballistics, what we have is a chunk of hp on top of hp. That's how armor works in empires. So it gets boiled down to simply damage, how much damage does it do. We have tons of options on damage, pick one for something to actually compare to. You know I had to rework my thinking a bit, but it all makes sense when I replace the word "jeep" with "medium tank" or "upgraded light tank". Then your suggestion doesn't seem horribly out of place, and a rather decent idea. When you say jeep though, you give the impression of something that is available from the start, is incredibly cheap, and sole function is getting from point a to point b really fast. My point being I didn't see this as having the firepower of a medium, or possibly a heavy depending on that cycle time, on something you either get early game to get an advantage or late game to go toe to toe with heavier chassis. A jeep shouldn't ever have that kind of firepower, it defeats its own purpose. As some side grade to a med though? Yeah then it works out fine. Works out well enough I wouldn't mind you getting this at the same time as med tank research completing.
You consider HAJ having a firepower of a medium or heavy? Then remove AFV if you actually believe that... HAJ is an IMV/IFV and possibly an ultra-light AFV. Learn what an IMV is and learn why armies around the world have. The world of The Empires is on comparable modern/cold war era tech... Warfare is going to be similar. In real world you have HUMVEE's with tank killing capability and you're an american, you should have casual knowledge of what your army has... You have HUMVEE's with TOW's, automatic grenade launchers, 50.cal BMG heavy machineguns, Javelins etc...
I laughed... both at the fact that you think people should know about their country's military hardware. And then the fact that Americans are so hyped about their military and "serving the country" that it might actually be a valid point...
Why are you looking at the real world. Have you not noticed how arcadey empires is? Your example weapons are really high damage. Uml, that 2 slot missile, does 60 damage a hit. And you want to give these jeeps something that does gren damage? 130 damage a hit? If you really want to the game to work like that then you have to completely rebalance it. And for what? What are you going to actually get? What's the end goal for all these changes? Your putting in a ton of work for not a lot of gain.
