I do want to note that, at least in my experience, almost no one uses "repro" for "reproduced". Also, that MG turrets haven't been buffed at all; they all had their turn speed equalized, so level 1's turn faster and level 3's turn slower, but that's literally all that's changed with them. No range, ROF or damage changes.
Fuck that.....We need Laser Towers and Death Blossom like yesterday. Even as a com you can exploit turrets #1 weakness.......WALLS. The problem is commanders kind of suck. Be has a weakness.....Walls. ml's can only shoot straight. But Cannons shoot at an arch. Use walls and shoot over them. Also read the scripts. There may just be an armor the might have resistance to ml's. If that's the case then Empires has no programmers. This would be true except....Do you realize how often he is pushing out updates? He is testing the best that he can. Since we have such a small population he is kind of stuck with live test. Other time you can see that he will start up a local server. I am kind of amazed at what he has accomplished with such little support. Can anyone here even remember what the last new vehicle weapon was before he joined the dev team ? Has anyone even noticed the possibilities of what some of his new weapons allow? We have 1 slot weapons. We have had people complaining for years to make light tanks and afvs more useful. Instead of riding his ass why not help out? Give some ideas of some changes that you feel would help. Keep in mind that he has said in game he is limited to particles we already have.(hint hint @ Empty)
I can't take too much credit (really none at all). The entire vehicle system is pretty top notch. From armors to engines to chassis to weapons, if you have the art, then it's pretty stinking effortless to add new stuff to the game.
I can tell you right now that no armor has a specific resist against anything. The most you can say is abs resists faster weapons, technically it resists everything a bit because there isn't a minimum speed requirement. Still, cannons are the main thing that gets its damage nerfed from abs. Though it isn't as one sided as it once was because missile speed has been steadily going up to make them more useful in tank combat. That said you could potentially make armors have specific resists I think. Most armors already have a couple of resists to infantry weapon fire and it looks exactly how it does in the infantry resist scripts. The question is do want more of a hard counter system? It's one thing I kinda didn't like about the abs buff recently, there is absolutely no reason for nf to get anything other than abs.
I thought the "InfantryMissileResist" gave resistance to all missiles or was that fixed ? I thought that's why the other specific resistance got added if not here they are - GeneralPhysicsResist - General Physics Tree Damage GeneralChemistryResist - General Chemistry Tree Damage GeneralMechanicalResist - General Mechanic Tree Damage GeneralElectricResist - General Electric Tree Damage GeneralBiologicalResist - General Biological Tree Damage KineticResist - Railguns, Standard Cannons, Anything that is just force ExplosiveResist - HE, Nukes, anything that explodes BioResist - Has the bio effect BulletResist - Non Armor damaging APBulletResist - Armor Damaging BulletExplosiveResist - Bullets that Explode MissileResist - Generic Missile type of damage MissileExplosiveResist - Explosive type. MissileBioResist - Bio Missiles. Different than Bio? KineticArtResist - Kinetic Artillery ExplosiveArtResist - Explosive Artillery BioArtResist - Bio Artillery AircraftMissileResist - Aircraft Missiles AircraftGroundMissleResist - Aircraft Missiles to hit ground targets AircraftBulletResist - Aircraft to Aircraft bullets AircraftAPBulletResist - Aircraft Bullets to hit ground targets AircraftBombResist - Bombs AircraftBombBioResist - Bio Bombs? InfantryGrenadeResist - Player Thrown Grenades InfantryMineResist - Player Tossed Mines InfantryMissileResist - Gren Missiles InfantryMortarResist - Gren Mortars InfantryStickyResist - Sticky Grenades InfantrySeismicResist - Seismic Grenades InfantryBulletResist - Infantry Bullets InfantryUtilityResist - Concussion nades, various infantry stuff that does special things but no damage ExtraType1Resist - Anti Building weapons ExtraType2Resist ExtraType3Resist
Yes, I'm saying currently those resists aren't in the armor scripts. Even reactive's rpg resists was commented out. And because of how they are similarly displayed I'd assume that you could add on resists if you wanted to, but I can't be sure because I don't know if the code has to specifically look for it or not. Would be easy to test for, but I'm lazy as can be and not to sure I like the idea of generic hard counters. I kinda want abs to not be so great against rails and plasma.
What would be fun is to allow each side to vote for which faction they want to play, or COM chooses - since he's doing the research. So one team could vote NF, the other could also vote NF, or any combination of NF, BE. No one could complain one was OP vs the other. Colors would need to remain blue vs red. In situations that one side is thought to be OP - no one could complain, then you could add anything you like, except the factions would grow further and further apart. Also ideally before a game can even start - EVERYONE in spec chooses two com's. You vote for your favorite com - they don't opt in. Based on the vote they either accept or reject, at which time it goes to the next best selection. This will generate a rally to get a decent game and not enable nubs to opt in for commanding - unless it is an all nub server. But a com map won't start until two COM's are selected and accepted. I'll post some analysis of the scripts once I'm done.
Empires 2.52.7 - Buffing of NF, Nerfing of BE This shows some obvious buffing of NF over BE. I understand that NF heavies needed to be buffed a little - but these dual triple slot, fast fire, no heat, huge ammo supply ML's are OP. BE tanks are more expensive, lighter, lower armor, less stationary turn speed, BE Heavy lower health. Comparing the OLD folder to current. When NF heavy armor dropped from 6 sheets to 5, NF health went from 250 to 500 and max ML's went from 5 to 6. Also NF medium health went from 200 to 300. At the same time the BE heavy went from health of 250 to 400 (100 less than NF). So this NF buff was intentional. NF med health 200 to 300 (same). Only advantage BE took on last Spartacus mod is that NF Light tank went from 150 to 200, BE AFV went from 200 to 300. But BE light tank is larger than NF, and an easier target. Note that the BE light tank now has the same health as a BE medium. So BE to win early should focus on a light tank rush. NF has to hold out until heavies. So BE will almost never win Money, but should always win Dust Storm. APC's are same on both and buffed health to 250.
I'm pretty sure you can use any resist in the armors. But as you mentioned, it's a clunky solution. Your analysis is missing the hitboxes differences, which are probably the largest difference between each side's vehicles.
Pretty sure the main issue is how fast you can get Heavy tanks. Back when UML was OP as fuck. The game was still balanced by the time it took to get heavies. It created that back and forth. Where BE would own NF with meds. Take 90% of the map. Then when heavies rolled out NF would missile spam their way to victory. The problem now is that there is nothing to stop NF from skipping meds.
JGF, Spartacus is right you aren't looking at hit boxes, Nf meds and to an extent heavies handle like crap compared to be too because of how narrow they are. You are also off with the weight of heavys, they have the same amount of free weight, meaning they can equip the same amount of stuff. It's 470 for both. Meds are different, but that was so nf can utilize the extra plate of armor.
The Angle Armor has not changed. Is this supposed to show that BE has an advantage that warrants all the changes you've made to nerf weight, armor, cost, turn speed and max weight? NF: //define the angles of the armor sides to determine where to deal damage based on hit location "Armor Angle 1" "70" "Armor Angle 2" "110" "Armor Angle 3" "240" "Armor Angle 4" "300" BE: //define the angles of the armor sides to determine where to deal damage based on hit location "Armor Angle 1" "55" "Armor Angle 2" "125" "Armor Angle 3" "235" "Armor Angle 4" "305" Wouldn't you think sitting and firing with double the turn speed of NF gives NF heavies a major advantage for veteran drivers over BE? If I show you a different armor - it doesn't matter what the angle is. If I can't show you a different armor then it certainly does. I claim your changes were and since you've started doing script changes are too large and much more than your claimed 7%.
We mean how the nf heavy is twice as tall. Nf meds too. This means you can't hit anything right next to you and you are simply a bigger target to hit. I tested rotation speed too, using gas turbine be heavy takes about 7 secs to do a full rotation at a stand still. Nf takes about 6 secs. That isn't double the speed man. If you go full forward while turning Be heavy tanks actually have a smaller turn circle too, which is generally more useful in most circumstances.
In that 7% rule, 7% is the minimum, not the maximum. But it doesn't matter because I don't really use that rule, I just make sure that certain changes are quickly noticeable. There's also the issue of reflective. BE Meds & Heavies simply have sharper angles. Reflective is just a good idea for BE, whereas it's pretty questionable for NF.
I know there was some talk of the hitbox differences, so I threw together a comparison so people don't have to just "trust" us when we say that vehicle hitboxes are vastly different between the two teams. Since I have like no experience with the models and can't recompile them to save my fucking life, I might be picking the wrong hitbox, but hopefully Smithy will come to my rescue. And even if these aren't the hitboxes that are used to calculate hits & misses, then they are probably the ones used to calculate weight distribution for handling, which is a big deal (i.e. why the LT is amazeballs).
yes/no. Weight distribution is mostly handled by the wheel placement and the weight of the vehicle. The wight is placed over the entire physics model evenly. So even the fender weighs as much as the middle of the tank. Wheel placement has the MOST effect on the tanks handling. That why I was messing with virtually extending the wheels out from the physics model. It gave fantastic handling at high speeds and bumps although the tradeoff was slow turn. Remember when I showed you how to make hover tanks? You can drive those over water btw.
I think I missed the lesson on hover tanks. O_o Anyway, I figured that the shape of the physics model probably mattered for how a particular chassis can handle. I mean, it can't all be wheel placement, right?
You know, the "lol BE threads" thing really does a number on amount of stickies you can get in. If you really cant fix it, make a tooltip explaining that you cannot damage BE tanks unless you actually hit the hull. Its really unintuitive.
Ok well they were not hover tanks... more like hover jeeps. They were armory high off the ground. Well the physics model will probable change how the vehicle handles when NOT attached to the ground as in flying/falling. (no testing done by me on that though) What kind of interaction are you expecting between the ground and the vehicle based on shape that is no the interaction between ground and tires? Are you expecting there to be drag placed on the vehicle from air while driving?
