New Infantry Sounds Test

Discussion in 'Testing Discussion' started by Donald Trump, Oct 18, 2016.

  1. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Sort of, some do need fixes and slight tweaks to make them all sound more in line with each other. I agree to an extent. This will be fixed throughout the beta and through the next patch but as you can see from people who DID help me test when I asked for it most were saying it was good.

    The originals were also really really old, and were lacking in quality. This was to update it. Yea, people who loved the old sounds aren't going to be thrilled for the new ones, but these will grow on you.

    Absolutely not. I didn't change it because I could, I changed it because if everything wasn't done at once it would sound really off. Imagine if the BE weapons were done and you were fighting NF with the old ones, it would sound kind of lopsided where one side had guns that felt like they did damage and the others didnt. Or one updated cannon, and the rest not. The old sounds were lacking, quite a lot. Most were mono tracks on par with tape recording. Not only would quality be off, it would just sound weird having a different sound that doesn't match the others in style, at least now I can get them all to match.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2016
  2. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    4,823
    Likes Received:
    190
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I think you missed my point about how a bunch of the new sounds lack the impact of the old ones. I don't mean impact sounds, I mean the impact of the weapon firing. There was a bit more oomph to the old ones.

    New mortar sounds weird as hell.
     
  3. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Well considering some of these are recordings I have taken when going out and shooting, they are on par with real guns. I personally feel like they have a lot more oomph than the old ones along with more variety. The old ones were all the same variation of the guns to me, not really being unique. They all seemed to be a different "click" which is what inspired me to add the variety to them.

    I want it to be known, I can't please everyone. Lots of people have liked the new mortar sound and such thus far, even through testing when I started this many months ago. It was one of the first sounds I did.

    I don't want to come off as defensive that you are insulting me, believe me. It's hard to please everyone and I realize this and I have been trying my hardest throughout this whole process to communicate and talk with people who tried out the sounds and get their feedback. Hell, I was even begging people to give me feedback to see if I was going in the right direction and I would take their feedback and try to incorporate it to make it better. I have been open to communication, I have been open about my whole process and I will continue to do so, but if I say "well others like it" don't take that as me trying to defend my own ego. Sorry, I had to say this because I don't want to come off as a douche who can't take criticism.
     
  4. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    4,823
    Likes Received:
    190
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I fail to see the insult I have committed.

    All I can say is tripwire did the same thing, many of the sounds from killing floor 2 are recordings of real guns, but this doesn't make it "better". Possibly more realistic, but that doesn't mean it conveys the same feeling of holding a big powerful weapon. You just kinda have to play them to get what I mean, but sounds impart a great deal of feeling of how the weapon you are using is working, how effective it is.

    Currently new pistol1 feels weak even though it is strong, shotgun kinda goes "poof" which sounds weak as can be, new behr sounds good for a rifle but the old sound had this heaviness that really helped give the impression of shooting loads of huge bullets. It felt "powerful" and I don't quite get this from the new sound. I can recognize that you are in a state of editing these, this isn't the final version, but seeing where it is and how many things are being changed I don't quite have the feeling that the impact of the weapons I liked is going to come back.

    I admit I only tested BE, I don't know what Nf holds. Seeing how everything has changed though I bet my feelings are going to be roughly the same, half of it works and the other half won't for me because it feels like the impact of using a weapon is missing.

    I can agree that there wasn't a ton of variety in the old sounds, and I do appreciate the addition of sound to help differentiate them. I'm just with whoever said that it might be best to just roll out the sounds that are in a good position and make sure the rest are up to snuff before releasing them. At the moment the quality between them all is a bit everywhere.
     
  5. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I didn't say you insulted me, I simply don't want to come off as I am being defensive as if I had been insulted and not willing to accept criticism.

    Pistol 1 isn't strong, it's meant to be weak but accurate. I think it conveys it quite well. The BEHR I liked personally more than the old one, and I think most people have as well.

    The person who said that also didn't try the sounds out. I made note of why it is a bad idea to roll out the "ones that are 100% good" because then quality and differences will be off across the board and people will complain about that. It's an all or nothing thing and the beta is going to provide feedback on how to fix it.

    The testers who tested before:
    LT
    Dogma
    Scrat
    Paradox
    JustGoFly
    Hawk
    Terminator

    There were a couple more but I forgot who.

    These people all gave feedback and it generally passed the inspection of all of them, all of them disliking and liking certain sounds, but again I can't please everyone. So far, most people who have tried out the beta like the new sounds, JK logged on and said he loved the new shotgun sound and loved the repair sound. There is going to be a lot of disagreement changing and updating such a long standing aspect of the game, I know but we will disagree and such on certain things. Most aren't noticing the smaller issues, especially since most of the intensity issues are now fixed and the beta is the best chance I will get at figuring out these issues that people are having and fixing them.
     
  6. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    4,823
    Likes Received:
    190
    Trophy Points:
    0
    P1 does about the same or more then the smgs depending on how you look at it. This reminds me, smg2 does sound nice.
     
  7. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

    Messages:
    1,368
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    0
    To be honest the sounds just don't fit together, that's why you can't just go grab sounds over the internet and put them together in a game.
     
  8. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Great. Some of them are recorded by me though so... yea.... Not exactly "all online".

    This is why I wanted people to test out the sounds. So far, people have liked the new sounds. Anyone who tested them, generally gave a thumbs up for the sounds. Also, you CAN grab them if you do it correctly, hence why I said I'd be updating them throughout beta to try and get them to fit together better. For me, I think its an improvement overall and I'm not just saying that. For some of the "sharp" sounding or "distant" sounding ones, I can mess with equalization and reverb to get them to sound similar, like I will be doing in the beta but it's not nearly as bad as some of you saying it's "all sounds". It really isn't.

    I just want to say... perhaps feedback earlier on would have been better than commenting and essentially saying "they don't fit" when it's in beta but I guess that's just me. The people who did test it early on, some of them, liked it enough that they were using it and asking me when I updated new sounds so they could have those as well. They are new sounds, you have to get used to it. We are all used to the old ones, it's a big change and you won't like all of them because you were so used to them. Just give it a chance, it did add more variety which is exactly what I wanted. Whenever sounds change in a game, people always get up in arms who were used to the old ones (Killing floor 1 -> Killing floor 2, CSGO with the new sound update, etc) but overall they are usually improvements. I just ask you to try it and see if you like it after you get used to it. I know after using these changes for so long I can hardly recall the old ones unless I go back to the soundbackup folder I have.

    Edit: Regarding P1, I pictured a weaker sounding pistol to add more variety to the pistol sounds. P1 is the weakest sounding because it does the least damage for the three of them. It conveys accuracy over damage, which is what I went for. I do have a slight edit for it to increase the bass though so it might sound a little bit better for you.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2016
  9. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

    Messages:
    1,368
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Uh... beta is there for feedback stuff like that, no need to have it tested before the beta. And I'm sorry if you don't like my feedback, but that won't make me change it.
     
  10. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I never said I don't like your feedback. Ask anyone who has tested the sounds before hand, I have been EXTREMELY open to feedback.

    This is a big change. No one is going to really like it at first because it is a big change and changes something that has been in empires for a VERY long time. Beta is for feedback, and I welcome all of it. However, your feedback in beta can also be transferred into a different end product which means when you complain about a sound, I can update it to be better. Just give me time, put your "complaints" about specific weapons here and I will try to edit them. That is all I ask.

    The reason this is in Beta now is because it passed the testers approval so yea.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2016
  11. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

    Messages:
    1,368
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    0
    can't give real feedback until I've played at least a dozen 26vs26 games so at this rate that'll be in a year or so.
     
  12. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

    Messages:
    2,610
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I haven't tested anything today but as of last night I did not like most of what I heard. I think the old sounds were fine for the most part.. I will go in later and see if anything sounds better since you tweaked stuff.
    I know you worked hard on this as anyone does who contributes so I do appreciate your effort and time and willingness to improve the game, I just don't like the outcome so far.
     
  13. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You also experienced a weird glitch that no one else has had and I am looking into. I will troubleshoot it with you later, but no one else has had it so it's ghard for me to figure out the exact issue.

    Again, I think most frequent players who are here on the forums are just "used" to the old ones. I, again, can not make changes when everyone says "the old ones worked fine!". There were plenty of issues with the old ones that warranted this change and I have stated them previously.

    This, again, is an issue with people not liking change, especially to something they have grown to know for many years. It is new. It is shocking. It is different. It's not the normal game you remember when you log in because of this, which leads me to think that they aren't adversely bad, it's just the "difference" making it the issue. This is why time is needed for sounds especially, because you know the old ones and these new ones seem foreign, different, out of place compared to what you know. This isn't like a script change which is immediate results, a change in sounds is a time process and I know I have come to like these new sounds along with others who were using it during my tests for months now.


    Edit: If you think a sound is "out of place", such as distant or not really matching a certain style that you prefer, message me on steam. I have a running list of changes to make on a google doc where I will add your complaint/request to. I am very open about this, and try to record everyone's feedback. Over the course of this beta I will be attempting to unify all sounds more than I already have and give it that "Empires" feel but it will take time as I am not going to release 1 sound patches for the beta. I will clump a bunch together and push it to see if it fixes the issue. I will try to get the first "fix" out on the 16th for all of this to allow future testing.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2016
  14. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

    Messages:
    2,610
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Not at all DT, please don't take offense, and certainly please do not chalk it up to people don't want change
    its not that we dont want change or want the old sounds only, if the change was for the better we would be open to it, I know I would. You need to see or hear things from our prospective. You may be too close to it to be objective.

    Misfire told me he had the same bad sound when changing weapons, I believe.

    You need to be open to the critiques, and not invalidate them by saying we don't want change or we are just used to the old ones.
     
  15. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Vicki, are you seriously going to accuse me of not being open? Jesus christ.

    This ENTIRE TIME I have said I am open, I have said I know some of the problems, I have said I know and am open to listening, not to be rude but did you even read what I said?

    I have been very open to listening to people, I have been commended by other players for listening and being open to their suggestions, so do NOT accuse me of "being too close to be objective". If I am taking a very defensive tone right now, it is because you are out right accusing me of something I pride myself in not being.

    I don't get why you are saying that "Misfire told me he had the same bad sound when changing weapons" as if I don't care. I even ACKNOWLEDGED this and said it is a "glitch" that needs fixed and I even said I would work with you to trouble shoot it later, but you throw it up at me as if I am stone walling you and completely ignoring you, invalidating your opinion because I intend your ears to be in pain.

    I am not invalidating what people are saying, I am simply saying that you are all used to the old ones... so new ones are going to sound out of place at first. Your brain is used to the old, so new stuff is going to sound different and out of place. That is what I am saying. You even said "I liked the old ones" and you don't think that is a bit of bias? You are here accusing me of being biased because I am "close" to them, yet you saying you like the old one's isn't bias? By directly stating you don't think it needed to be changed, you have made known your bias about how you didn't want change in the first place.

    Please don't accuse me of "not caring". I have tried very hard to get as much feedback as possible from as many people as possible before this went into the Beta. I have even said I am open to making changes and listening to people, this is why I have had this up for nearly two months, to get feedback. Plenty of people have helped me test during this time and plenty of people have said it is an improvement.
     
  16. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    4,823
    Likes Received:
    190
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I'll admit that when I first saw this thread I thought it was just a custom sound pack, I didn't realize it was going to be added to the base game. I would have jumped in a bit sooner if I had known
    I've spent more time on kf2 and I still say a lot of weapons sounded better in kf1. Sure new stuff is a bit cleaner or clearer, but that doesn't quite mean better. I'm with vicki here, it's not that I'm used to old stuff, it's that I just think I think some of the new stuff isn't an improvement.
     
  17. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    "Some of the new stuff isn't an improvement"

    Great. What.

    Saying "Some of the stuff is shit" isn't helping me fix it, it's just saying "You did a bad job." If you want me to attempt to fix the problem, I need specifics. It's the point of beta. Give me feedback so I can fix it.

    You are used to the old sounds, I really do think this is SOME of the issue, especially when people tell me they "Liked the old ones better" or "It didn't need change" and then come in here to critique. Of course they have a bias, and if I call it out then I will be viewed as ineligible to take a critique and an asshole. I have had many people test this before and it got generally a green light from all those people.
     
  18. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

    Messages:
    2,610
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    0
    also if you are going to invalidate our feedback by saying we don't want change no one is going to want to test it and give you feedback.

    I just went in and checked out a few sounds..out of breath is better glad you took my advice, the siren has to go very annoying and some male voice is talking and no idea what its saying but that needs to go too.
    the smgs sounds fine as does the pistols (engi) the seismic nade is too low needs to be louder.
    The CV going forward sound is needs to be changed, doesnt sound real and its shrilly sounding..the backing up sound is good but stops after a bit and goes silent.
    the calc sound is annoying because its scratchy and shrilly.

    that weird sound I got when changing back to my smg isn't happening today
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2016
  19. Paradox

    Paradox I am a gigantic asshole who loses people's hard wo

    Messages:
    6,926
    Likes Received:
    148
    Trophy Points:
    0
    DT, I still have the old sounds from when I had to test it for the first time. How do I get the new ones?
     
  20. Kidpaler

    Kidpaler Member

    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    58
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thats not invalidating your opinion, I'm just saying open up to the suggestions rather than simply going into it with the mind set of "I don't want change" and "I liked the old better". This is different, it requires time to process that.

    Also, regarding the out of breath thing, this is kind of my point. I have only changed that on my end, I haven't pushed it public yet, but you are telling me it's better now. I'm not saying this as insulting, I'm just saying as you couldn't tell the difference that I changed it that is a factor that has to be taken into account when taking feedback.

    CV sound goes silent, it does that in current version sounds. Engines stop making sound after X seconds, it's an issue with looping nothing I can fix.

    I'll come up with a new barracks sound.

    If the SMG issue happens, please let me know


    @Paradox Go to the Beta Branch for Empires, they are there now.
     

Share This Page