Map overhaul poll

Discussion in 'Mapping' started by Silk, Mar 9, 2014.

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Which map would you prefer getting an overhaul?

Poll closed Mar 30, 2014.
  1. canyon

    5 vote(s)
    45.5%
  2. duststorm

    3 vote(s)
    27.3%
  3. isle

    4 vote(s)
    36.4%
  4. mvalley

    4 vote(s)
    36.4%
  5. slaughtered

    3 vote(s)
    27.3%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. wealthysoup

    wealthysoup Lead Tester

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    Unrelated to what you've done. But to get feedback its probably a good idea to post the picture at the actual resolution/size of the ingame minimap
     
  2. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    I've been trying to build cubemaps for cyclopean all day, and it just won't work. What am I doing wrong?

    Edit:
    Found it eventually. Didn't know the 2013 version had broken cubemaps, and since it didn't give an error or weird graphics, I never noticed my maps didn't have any reflections. Although in my defense my own maps never really had any reflections. In the city in cyclopean though it was very obvious that it wasn't working. Will recompile some other maps I recompiled with this unofficial workaround as well.

    Sigh

    I realize it's been quite a few years since I last liked valve tbh.
    Stupid c*nts
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2014
  3. CyberKiller

    CyberKiller Nyooks!

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    If cubemaps won't build it often means that the cubemaps that were previously built are just black textures, the only two ways to make it work are: recompiling the map,
    or, extracting the pak lump from the bsp, then deleting the pak lump from the bsp, then deleting the cubemap textures from the extracted files, then finally adding the files back minus the cubemaps then rebuilding them as normal. (also don't forget to build cubemaps in HDR mode, change to no HDR, restart the game then build the cubemaps again for LDR.)

    A trick to test cubemaps is to replace one of the empires weapon's view model with the "cubemap weapon" so you can quickly see if cubemaps are working in HDR and LDR modes.
    Also manually extracting the bsp pak and looking at the cubemaps with vtfedit is another good way (there should be cubemap files for HDR and non-HDR).
    I plan on making a proper tutorial on building and testing cubemaps at some point because like 60% of custom maps for empires have broken cubemaps in some way.

    tldr: Building the cubemaps won't replace cubemaps that were already built even if they are completely broken. (Renaming the bsp then rebuilding also works but then any compiled in vmt files for textures with cubemaps will still point to the broken cubemaps.)
    It's probably just easier to recompile really.

    Also downfall didn't get a HDR compile, I assume this is intentional?
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2014
  4. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    It was intentional, but mostly because I was so happy with the LDR light that I didn't feel like HDR was needed plus I wasn't confident I could get it as good. Might give it a try one day, not sure.

    I did try with the minimap again. These are the ingame resolutions (both high and low) and switched (top is darker, bottom lighter)
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_downfall/emp_downfall_other minimap 3.jpg
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_downfall/emp_downfall_other minimap 4.jpg

    And yeah making the cubemaps is now a bit more tricky. There's now no longer an official method that works. This is how I have to make them now:

    1) Name the vmf exactly as the bsp will have to be named in the end (any name change before OR after building cubemaps will break it)
    2) Do a fresh compile
    3) Use Vide (or other software) to open the bsp and remove all textures and HDR textures and save it
    4) Start Empires and open the map
    5) sv_cheats 1
    6) mat_specular 0 (or you'll get pink colors into your cubemaps)
    7) buildcubemaps
    8) mat_hdr_level 0 (step 8 through 11 are for HDR maps only)
    9) open the map again
    10) buildcubemaps
    11) mat_hdr_level 2
    12) open the map again
    13) mat_specular 1

    As long as there's a workaround I shouldn't complain I suppose ...
     
  5. CyberKiller

    CyberKiller Nyooks!

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    When you say remove all textures from the bsp I assume you just mean the .vtf files in the root of /materials/<map name>/?

    Because removing everything would remove the vmt files that tell the game what cubemap to apply to each brush/displacement that has a reflective texture applied to it.
    (And there is some other stuff that gets compiled in to it as well other than cubemaps.)
     
  6. Trickster

    Trickster Retired Developer

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    It just occured to me - are the original cliffs even needed on the minimap?
     
  7. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    In Vide at least so far I had to delete all textures (not the materials, just the textures). This was the case for cyclopean, canyon, bush and arid:
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_downfall/vide.jpg

    I have yet to see a map that stores more than the cubemaps textures in its bsp

    I'll make one without to compare, but it'll look strange I think

    Edit:
    Without cliffs (and therefor also without shadows):
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_downfall/emp_downfall_other minimap 5.jpg
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_downfall/emp_downfall_other minimap 6.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2014
  8. Trickster

    Trickster Retired Developer

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  9. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    I agree. The minimap is functional.
     
  10. 101010

    101010 Member

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    At first I hated this map with a passion. Mainly because of how loud the background sound was. Not sure if you lowered the sound of if I just got used to it. But now I love this map. It is one if the best for low to medium population. I've had some really interesting rounds on this map.
     
  11. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Never changed the sound tbh. Surprised though, I have to concentrate to even hear it at all. But I'm glad you like it now :)

    And yeah it was designed for small playercount as requested by Vicky years ago.
     
  12. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    Are the cliffs intentionally really really dark?

    I've noticed that it's super easy to hide up there.
     
  13. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Trickster said something similar, but cyclopean and money for example are much, much darker in the shade. Downfall isn't even dark, not even close. Are you sure if you check your brightness/gamma that they're set correctly?

    With the correct settings, the only places you could possibly hide in would be underneath some of the trees.

    Edit:
    The single darkest part in downfall which only happens in one location:
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/darkness/downfall.jpg
    Darkness in Cyclopean:
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/darkness/Cyclopean 1.jpg
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/darkness/Cyclopean 2.jpg
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/darkness/Cyclopean 3.jpg
    Darkness in Money:
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/darkness/money 1.jpg
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/234836/mapping/darkness/money 2.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2014
  14. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    I'm mostly talking about the dark cliffs where infantry can ambush enemies passing through.

    Darkness, itself, isn't a bad thing. But when there are dark areas very close to light areas, you get interesting gameplay. Honestly, I thought it was intentional.
     
  15. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Darker areas were intentional yes. Each of the 4 area's has one narrower entrance which is darker.

    Still wouldn't call them "dark" though as you can see everything. However someone proned and not moving is indeed easy to miss, which as you said is interesting for infantry gameplay and lacking in most maps. The moment you move though you're dead ... or at least spotted.
     
  16. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    Lol, I was actually talking about the elevated infantry-accessible cliffsides on either side of the four valleys that connect each of the four open areas, but I think it's clear that there are A LOT of dark areas on the map, lol.
     
  17. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    post from awhile ago, but still
    theres something wrong with the new hammer, i believe. i never had my physics even close to 100% before the update, and now they are (i used power of 4, lol)

    you probably wont notice a change in performance, since those maps were compiled using an earlier version of hammer
    as soon as im done with finals, ill add you and we'll get this going! (its official, btw)
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2014
  18. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

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    I'm a bit late but...Isle is boring as hell, doubt anyone likes it as is.
     
  19. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    I do :(
     
  20. Beerdude26

    Beerdude26 OnThink(){ IsDownYet(); }

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    It's pretty nice, you can do some fun flanking movements. No matter where you build an outpost, it can always be flanked.
     

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