Votekicking squad leads

Discussion in 'Under Consideration' started by BigTeef, Jun 7, 2014.

  1. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

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    Had to deal with people going squad lead and ignoring any type of basic instruction and wasting tickets.

    I want to remove the squad leads who don't know what their doing, similar to vote kicking the commander but only squads members do it for their squad.

    Candles mentioned something about this and I figured we put this idea on paper instead of leaving it as spec ramblings.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  2. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    How do you structure it?

    A player in a squad claims that he should be the squad leader of his current squad and the entire team votes on it?
     
  3. Señor_Awesome

    Señor_Awesome Member

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    What if we just made the commander able to kick people from squads.

    Please.
     
  4. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

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    He can do that already, but there are maps with no commander available.
    And it would make maps like district and escort less of a pain in the ass.
     
  5. Señor_Awesome

    Señor_Awesome Member

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    Pretty sure he can't...

    Or at least I can't, last I tried. Made me extremely frustrated that the box was grayed out. I assumed it was to prevent me from being a total dick and constantly kicking somebody from a squad.
     
  6. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    Commander can promote whoever to lead, this isn't too much of a problem on comm maps. Infantry maps mess everything up though because there is no way of dealing with when someone goes afk or doesn't listen or can't get a clue. A simple squad vote that requires all the other players in that squad would be best, shouldn't involve the whole team.

    Edit: Teef is fast. You can though, you just need to be in driving mode, it doesn't work in comm view for some reason.
     
  7. Señor_Awesome

    Señor_Awesome Member

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    I need to retry I guess. Because I remember the last time I tried I got the option to promote to lead, but not the option to kick some wankers when I clicked on them.
     
  8. Metruption

    Metruption Member

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    f > s > w kick squad leader, the only unused chatwheel option in f > s
     
  9. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    Oh, commander could never actually kick anyone, you just promote someone else to squad lead and they had to do it.
     
  10. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    Kicking the squad leader is worthless.

    What you really want is to ensure someone knowledgeable is in the position. So you need to vote someone else into the squad lead position. It probably makes the most sense to just have a button that triggers a vote to make yourself squad lead.
     
  11. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    no kicking squad leader is not useless
     
  12. Metruption

    Metruption Member

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    Who becomes squad leader after leader is kicked?
     
  13. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

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    Good question, give it to the person who joined the squad 2nd.
     
  14. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    I feel this is a little unworthy, unless Candles <3 this.

    On comm maps we have a comm solving this, even though I am surprised that even some vets are not awared of this function.
    On infantry maps, the issues could have been evaded easily by not joining that squad in the first place.
    This function can be misused if someone just doesn't like the squad lead, even though the leader isn't incompetent, especially if there's only 2/3/4 guys in the squad.

    How about just remove the squad lead automatically if he's afk?
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  15. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

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    There are more incidents of people being squad lead and not knowing what the fuck they are doing, and disbanding a squad that has 50 something squad points is the greatest sin I can think of on an infantry map.

    Voting to remove the squad leader than just plain leaving it and wasting the points sounds much better.
    Not to mention Candles said he would look into a feature to see if it can be done, because hearing candles scream at somebody for not listening is hilarious.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  16. Grantrithor

    Grantrithor Member

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    The points don't disappear if it gets disbanded, they stay.
     
  17. Candles

    Candles CAPTAIN CANDLES, DUN DUN DUN, DUN DUN DUN DUN.

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    Commanders can set squad leads themselves, yeah, but it distracts them by making them do something that really shouldn't require their intervention in the first place. With infantry maps, sometimes you can't tell if a person is going to use them right or not, and I'm somewhat against anything that encourages people making bundles of 3 and 4 man squads. As with anything else in the game, there would always be potential for abuse, so I'd make it require a majority of the players in the squad to agree, which is 2/3, 3/4 and 3/5 players in the squad voting for the kick. Finally, AFK detection is annoying and I'd rather not have to deal with it.

    Presumably, it'd either be the next person in the squad and I'd just let the code handle it, or a decent metric would be to give it to the person in the squad with the most points. I feel that it's safe to assume that the person in a squad with the most amount of points is either good enough to know what they're doing or good enough to follow instructions.

    Don't you keep complaining that the squad system is too complicated as it is? I would consider it much more complicated, both in terms of code and in actual usage, to have a player initiate a vote to make themself lead instead of just adding another button to the F-menu or squad menu to vote out a squad leader in the same way that voting out a commander is done.

    And then stuff just gets more complicated. What if multiple people try to initiate votes to make themselves lead? Do you override each vote with the most recent? Do you wait the first one out? What about AFK players, do you give a timeout for the vote? If so, how long? In the end, a squad votekick will give you the same issues that a comm votekick does, but the benefit is that we've gotten used to those issues already.

    If the squad lead is AFK or being useless and everyone else leaves, then the squad has been disbanded and the points are now gone for all practical purposes,
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  18. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

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  19. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    Fucking this.

    The cv can be empty, but squad lead cannot.

    This wouldn't be without flaws, but it'd probably be better than nothing.

    With the squad system, you're working with bandaids and only bandaids. It's an inherently flawed and complicated system. Your bandaid is probably the best.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  20. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    whats the annoying part about afk detection? or let me word the question differently, why would the most naive approach, "no input for x frames", be bad? even if you camp, you at least move your mouse a tiny bit over a suited timespan.

    its a serious question - no argument to make you do it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014

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