Fix The Research Tree Nesting

I cringe every time I have to research Improved Heat Transfer Fluids then Advanced Coolant Engine. It's unnecessary nesting.

I already did the necessary changes, no laziness excuses.

This affects Compo, Coolant, HEMG, UML & Spartacus's emotional well being.

For example, Coolant Engine:

Code:

		"Advanced Coolant Engine"
		{
			"Name"			"Advanced Coolant Engine"		//name given to research item
			"Parent"		"Chemistry"				//name of parent that this branches from
			"Description"		"(Technology: Vehicle Engine) Engineer an engine with standard horsepower but with the ability to cool components better than any other proposed engine design."	//description given when hovering over research item
			"Icon"			"comm/hex_cube"			//icon drawn on research tree
			"Unresearched Icon"	"comm/hex_cube_empty"		//icon drawn in the GUI
			"Type"			"0"		//nothing
			"Cost"			"0"		//cost of this research item
			"Time"			"120"		//time to research this item in seconds
			"Team"			""		//which team can research this
			"XPos"			"195"
			"YPos"			"48"
		}

//		"Improved Heat Transfer Fluids"
//		{
//			"Name"			"Improved Heat Transfer Fluids"		//name given to research item
//			"Parent"		"Chemistry"				//name of parent that this branches from
//			"Description"		"(Items In Category: Advanced Coolant Engine) Develop fluids with excellent heat transfer properties to be integrated into a standard engine."	//description given when hovering over research item
//			"Icon"			"comm/hex_multi"			//icon drawn on research tree
//			"Unresearched Icon"	"comm/hex_multi_empty"		//icon drawn in the GUI
//			"Type"			"0"		//nothing
//			"Cost"			"0"		//cost of this research item
//			"Time"			"60"		//time to research this item in seconds
//			"Team"			""		//which team can research this
//			"XPos"			"195"
//			"YPos"			"48"
//		}
//			"Advanced Coolant Engine"
//			{
//				"Name"			"Advanced Coolant Engine"		//name given to research item
//				"Parent"		"Improved Heat Transfer Fluids"	//name of parent that this branches from
//				"Description"		"(Technology: Vehicle Engine) Engineer an engine with standard horsepower but with the ability to cool components better than any other proposed engine design."	//description given when hovering over research item
//				"Icon"			"comm/hex_cube"			//icon drawn on research tree
//				"Unresearched Icon"	"comm/hex_cube_empty"		//icon drawn in the GUI
//				"Type"			"0"		//nothing
//				"Cost"			"0"		//cost of this research item
//				"Time"			"60"		//time to research this item in seconds
//				"Team"			""		//which team can research this
//				"XPos"			"195"
//				"YPos"			"72"
//			}

 

Technically it's a nerf because you could do half the research and see your enemy is going bio and switch to get bioMG, then grab your engine afterwards. Whereas with this, you have to wait the full time for adv coolant to finish, lowering your flexibility.

That said I support this, the research tree is still retarded half the time, at least improved detonators is gone (seriously wtf)

 

Nooooo, Spartacus.
This unnecessary nesting is to make the tree looks big. So people don't realize there's really nothing to research.
*tr0llface*

Empty's got a nice point though, even though I don't have an opinion.

 

By nesting are you talking specifically about single items being nested or research areas where more than one item can be nested?

 

Former, I believe.
You research Advanced Machining(60 secs) and there's only composite armor(90secs) inside.
You research Improved Warhead Compounds(90 secs) and there's only UML(90 secs) inside.

Spartacus suggested to make two researches as one, you only have to research Composite armor, removing "Advanced Machining", but make the research time 150 secs.

 

It's not clearly a buff or a nerf.

Buffs:

• You don't waste time queuing up research, both slightly decreasing the actual stopwatch research time and decreasing the times needed to go into com view.
  
• You can start a long research if you know you're going to lose the radar and then build a new one before the long research finishes (radars are only needed to start research, not finish, if you guys didn't know).

Ultimately those buffs are minor and the real value is the simplicity for noobs (and my sanity).

But for your purposes, the minor buffs more or less equal the minor nerfs.

 

D, I tend to agree on that point, but those thing really do not serve any purpose beside looking good and being menial work.

 

Nesting is a little retarded except that I feel the nesting exists because of either earlier the tree had more items under it, or for future expansion. As it is though, the tree is pretty dire.

I think we had a couple of versions where unlocking a nested tree would confer benefits. I guess that was most visible with MK II's where advanced chassis would give you access to MKII's. I would like to see a return to that, and maybe some expanded weapon features for lower tier vehicles.

Hey, what would happen if when you unlocked certain nested trees you had a benefit like 5% extra cooling, or 5% armour resistance, etc? Though I guess that would be a proper hell to balance...

 

5% wouldnt really do anything to be balanced around tbh.
Now, Id really like to see some fresh stuff in there that maybe for once doesnt rely on a gimmick, but mk2's and improved standart cannons really didnt do the game any good.
Making lower tier vehicles viable late game would be great. but with the armor plate system in place, I dont think there is any way to do that. I dont care if LT's can mount nukes again (lol old version reference), but they would still get nearly instant killed by double he or double homing.

 

Here's a fix, keep the nesting, but add more shit to research. Each tree could have a multitude of engines and armor to research.

 

I like nesting more stuf to do. Keep it.

 

Add infantry research!

 

I JUST played a match with a noob com that only researched advanced machining and moved on. We have no armor. gg.

This unnecessary nesting is a 100% artificial hurdle for new commanders.

Why?

 

Because that's not how most games out there goes.

As I previously stated in other thread, a lot of mechanisms in this game only work among us.

 

It's true, I had to explain nesting a lot last night, and even then sometimes it's hard to get.

Maybe the phrasing for the research tree is bad, maybe it should have something more along the lines of "unlock the researchables within" or something to make it really clear.

 

I get that, but why not fix it if you can?

The research names are the same, so it shouldn't fuck up any maps, right?