Beerdude's researchoverview (zooming)

It's a wireframe.

 

It seems like the easy way out, and it won't look good.

@dizzy/beerdude:

The hierarchical layout is harder to understand than what we have now.

The combi layout is okay, but it seems too simple, and as noted, involves sub pages.

The modular layout seems like a good idea, until you consider that it just allows a more complex version of what already exists. There will arguably be sub pages, and the only thing that will change is that more choices can be presented on a page.

 

It also fixed the issues with cluttering prevalent in the other alternatives.

 

I would also say that the tree Zygroth posted is the most clear way to show research options. Also i think a research tree should grow from bottom to top not vice-versa.

General suggestions for the new research tree:

• Have all technology trees shown expanded at all times, so you don't need to click around to find a deeper research
• Make information about the research (needed time and ressources) visible right on the overview map. (it could only be shown if you zoom in a little, if space is a problem)
• Give a highlighting in different colours to the following groups: armor, engine, missile weapons, cannon weapons, vehicle mgs

 

I still think that a diablo2 / wow-ish research tree is the best for a game like empires.

But to be honest its not logical to think about the structure of your research tree bevor you actually know what are the needs of the research tree. Make the researchs and it interactions bevor you draw a research tree. Its like making a rack bevor you think about what you want to put into it.

This is 800 x (I guess) 400 so it would fit on the screen and with popups that explain the research Icons it should work, I guess.

Edit: As long as the layout is not decided theirs no need to actually discuss the shape of the icons that represent the researchs...

 

The assumption I made, and I believe Beerdude made as well is that it should be able to fit any research layout, since it might be changed in the future, and its impossible to predict what it will change to.

The 3 layouts I drew out were made with this in mind, thats why for instance I wouldn't dare to create one specifically for the current tree. However, as I've noted as a pro, hierarchical and the combi are customizable, meaning they can be made to fit the current research tree or any other. They'll have to be customized differently for every different kind of research tree, but it could be a far better solution than a algorithmic one like the modular. Which is why I think Zygoths (hierarchical layout) actually is a very good screenshot showing that hierarchical layout will work very well. However, will need to be hand made again for a new tree.


The layouts I made are not meant to be graphical, they are pure wireframes, I'm not sure which kind yours is, or whether its a new kind, but I'm gonna guess your vote is for a customized hierarchical layout?

 

I didnt saw Zygoth post and its basical the same.



I think its important to discuss the balance between rushing one tech and having a broad spectrum of researchs. Basically between tunnel vision research and slow and diverse. That example I posted here is a popular way to prevent players from rushing one single game winning technology. Something like this can be combined with any type of research tree.

Edit: Dots represent the researchs you can choose from.

 

make it so u can click on like rails and it will research it all automatically including prereqs

 

Create a new thread. Also, if you're not gonna read threads, don't post.

 

:eek:
yelling at the Commander is an important aspect of gameplay for me, people command because they like to be yelled and shouted at.



Research starts in the edges of the hexagon and leads towards middle.
In the middle u find cake and CV turns into a blimp.

 

or the other way around from middle to outside.

basic things are:
1. research should get Color-coding so even if u have no idea what your doing, u know that GREEN means rocket-slot.
2. everything should be visible on _one_ page. that way u get an easy overlook and the image of a good overall research can burn an image into your head for the future.


I hate the current system of hectically clicking trough the deep menus and keep asking my teammates under which general tap ranged canon is.

 

Yes, the other way around would be better since the later branches contain more items (with exception of one item) than the root branch.

While color coding basically comes down to better icon representations of research item types, I'm a bit hesitant about color coding (other than shades of grey), because of color blind players, it definitely would not be a simple primary color distinction, if we would want to do it right the first time.

The point of color coding would be the ability to instantly distinguish the item types, even if for instance the items were very small and graphical icon details wouldn't be distinguishable. That being said, I do believe there are ways to make items distinguishable in a way that allows quick identification, without relying solely on colors. (Example of this are the minimap icons, although I admit they aren't that good, they're still distinguishable even at 32*32 size)

Good points are raised, keep em up

 

that should work even if your colorblind.



or this!



wait, that just doesn't work with current research tree.

HEY maybe make it an actual tree!

 

This little piggy researched heavies before engines and armor

then it died

 

U made my day :beaten_nf:

here some music for you to hear!​

 

Beerdude what do you want from a research tree beside clearness, easy navigation and readability. Its alot easier to offer a solution for a problem if you know all the details. Posting the ideas and concepts for the actuall research especially how time flows in the new research and how differentiated the new research should be would be a hugh plus. The outcome is usually way better if you make a custom product to solve a problem.

 

I like both Zygoth's and Mayama's first post (the one he mentioned is like Diablo 2 or someshit). I think they show the most detail, allow the most options from what could be added, and are the simplest to follow. I don't however, like Zygoth and Mayama's 2nd posts.

I want to make it clear that this thread isn't about reforming the research tree or anything like that, although suggesting certain capabilities of the tree (i.e. needing more than 1 research to get another one) is helpful.

 

Thats what I mean not the actual researchs but characteristics that need to be considered.

 

What I wanted was a research overview that allowed a commander and his team to see what research to conduct in what order. Ideally, this overview would be shown before round start so comm can get tips from other players for research, and this would tie in with a general pre-round discussion on what the general tactics will be.

I started working on it because I wanted to:
1) Explore how the VGUI animation system works
2) Help newbie commanders through their first rounds and experienced commanders through maps they've never commanded before, because you can't really teach new players very easily how and when stuff has to be researched on which maps