I think someone put in a bad value or something, because this sucks. For some comparison, lets go from clip to clip, the time from the first shot to the first shot of the next clip. High Explosive MG Research 3min, 975 res clip depleted in 15s, deals 450 dmg,next shot @+31s. +30 heat to self,2h/s x6 ammo depleted in 2:50, 2700 dmg 16 sustained dps Bio Machine Gun Research 4min, 1050 clip depleted in 10s, deals 330 (250+80bio) dmg, next shot @ +12s. +25 heat to self, 2.5h/s x4 ammo depleted in 0:46, 1240 (1000+160bio+80 for being bioed) dmg. If ammo can be maintained, the bio mg will do ~4060 dmg over ~2:50 ~23.5 sustained dps, not account for full bio effect damage Depleted Uranium MGx2 Research 3min, 900 res clip depleted in 28s,deals 1120-700 dmg, next shot @+34s.+70 heat to self, 2.5h/s x5 ammo depleted in 2:44, 5600-3500 dmg 34-21 sustained dps Depleted Uranium MGx3 Research 3min, 900 res clip depleted in 32.5s, deals 1800-1080 dmg, next shot @+40.5s. +135 heat to self,3.5h/s x5 ammo depleted in 3:15, 9000-5400 dmg, 46-27.5 sustained dps The DUMGx3 is the only gun that weighs more (+20 weight), and is the costs the same. All others cost less. Even with the instability of the bio mg damage, it deals more damage than the HEMG. All engines except for the standard should be able to fire continuously even in combat (full speed driveling). The DUMGx3 is only one that has a chance of overheating while stationary. The HEMG is underpowered against the physics MGs, 150% worst case, 200% best case for the DUMGx2, even more so for the x3. This is not including the anti-infantry lazarz that you get.
But its so inaccurate and shoots slow. DU could probably get more hits and therefore do more damage than HEMG over distance
Nickierv. Multiple developers of Empires had struggled with vehicle weapon scripts since 1.08. So don't come here and say they didn't pay attention to the machine gun values in the script files. They have. And that's why 2.24b is even better release than 2.12.
And you can kill infantry more easy with HEMG because of the splash damage. The only MG that might be underpowered is the Bio MG.
But when you look at Infantry vs Vehicle, the first shot is usually the one that counts, not the whole clip , HEMG would pretty much either kill or severely harm an infantry unit, as the second shot would finish them off. Veh vs Veh, the HEMG would be more effective coupled with a missile and cannon combo to really damage it :/, but right now it all depends on preference...and no I don't know where I'm going with this. Though the values may show it doesn't do as much as other weapons, just take into the fact of current armor resistances, plain and regen specifically, then you'll see that it'll do just as much damage as the other weapons, short of the UML.
HEMG is an unusual weapon, it doesn't do a lot of damage, but what damage it does do is pretty much independent of target speed, size, or distance. The correct way to fight it therefore is to avoid getting into the line of fire at a distance and to close range as fast as possible, while rotating your armor to survive the first clip. Once it runs out the long downtime and lack of close range power compared to other weapons should allow you to kill it. Of course when you mass HEMG it becomes very difficult to do that, so HEMG is a superb mass weapon, a group of APCs with APD and HEMG can take on most tanks short of heavies, especially with engies spawning in to repair them, and they can also keep going much better than other tanks because of the aforementioned infantry support. HEMG APC groups are basically wasp nests on treads.
HE MG is pretty much good enough, various reasons stated here. I renember when someone played with HE mg and in the testing it was so redicously powerful that double rails were a joke.
I remember in the forum prerelease of 2.24 HE MG had 20 damage and it was quite overpowered. I don't think I want to give it more than 15 damage at the current setting anymore :p
I think it's perfectly balanced with DU. Just don't think, "OH THEY BOTH MGS SO I USE THEM EXACTLY SAME" because you'll fail.
IMO bio MG is the key failer. It's like it's a bad all rounder. It's bad against tanks and bad against infantry, with a bad ROF and a bad clip size. Just a bit bad really.
After having a chance to fight a few HEMG apcs, I have reviewed the original problem. I forgot to take into account accuracy. At any more than 1500 units, DU is not going to hit the broad side of anything, so damage wise they are balanced. The problem that I am seeing is the reload time for the HEMG. With only 30 shots, it is not that hard to run your target out of ammo then close in for an easy kill while they are reloading. Keep the same overall damage output, decrease the damage to 12-10 and increase the reload speed to 8 or 10.
HEMG needs to travel in packs. It spits out alot of damage at basically any range, a bunch of HEMG's will kill things before they can even get in range of normal weapons. I would say other then the hour long reload its balanced.
HE MG, like all other vehicle mgs, are meant to be support weapons. Cheaper, lighter, crappier. If you rely on it as a primary weapon you fail. APC's have 3 slot versions that are slightly better and thus can be used as a "primary" SUPPORT weapon. Meaning it still isn't meant to fight tanks and such alone.
If it didn't have the long reload most light vehicles would be unable to kill it before it reloaded and finished them off. You are hard pressed to avoid dying to a HEMG apc in a light tank with good armor, it doesn't need to be harder.
