Updating the Official Map List

Steam Workshop still isn't a thing so the official maps that are provided with the game should be updated.
Before, you guys start debating about copyrights and other sorts of bullshit. I don't care, this isn't what this thread is about, go away.

Including more maps into the official map list would also mean they get maintained by official mappers and therefore don't get lost to time.
So here's a list of maps that should be included into the official map list and what needs to be fixed/changed for them to fit.


emp_atomic:

• Nothing!

emp_blackmountain:

• Some trees need to be lowered into the ground.
• Make the middle and South-West resource nodes output 2.

emp_blast:

• Remove Easter Eggs.

emp_downfall:

• Increase starting resources from 100 to 300.

emp_flat:

• Remove the engineer turret restriction.
• Pre-place the first refinery.

emp_fuel:

• Change the 1.5 resource nodes to output 1 or 2.
• Fix the minimap accordingly.
• Add green grid to the skybox.
• Lower north-east and south-west resource nodes to 3?
• Change tickets from 325 to 200 to make the middle flag an actual point of interest.

emp_hazard:

• Lower tickets from 450 to 200.

emp_homeland:

• Nothing?

emp_insurrection:

• Divide all resource nodes output by 2. Yellow should be 1, Red should be 2.
• Lower starting resources from 800 to 400.

emp_massacred:

• Increase starting resources from 200 to 300.
• Increase tickets from 150 to 200.
• Remove Slaughtered from the official map list.

emp_mesa:

• Nothing?

emp_plunge:

• Divide all resource nodes by 2.
• Figure out if the bridges should really be destructible.
• Remove the starting turrets.
• Lower starting resources from 500 to 400.

emp_raiders:

• Increase tickets from 200 to 400.

emp_silo:

• Fix the bad shadows, something something (ask someone who knows).
• Pre-place the first refinery.

emp_snowbound:

• Lower main base resource nodes output from 4 to 1.
• Lower middle resource nodes output from 3 to 2.
• Increase tickets from 200 to 300?
• Re-do the minimap, it's 512x512 instead of 1024x1024.

emp_temple:

• Increase starting resources from 150 to 300.
• Lower tickets from 375 to 200.

emp_tropicvendetta:

• Nothing?

emp_vehicletraining:

• Nothing?

emp_ward:

• Make the middle base a point of interest by adding a capture point or a refinery to it.
• General polish.

And now for the drama...
...Maps that should be removed from the official map list.

emp_escort
emp_money
emp_slaughtered
emp_eastborough

 

For downfall i remember years back they said it needed a new minimap to become official. Not sure wether anyone's done that or if it's still required.
An increase in starting res as much as you propose ... not a fan, but as long as you don't touch the res income i could go with it. I usually keep res income low on my maps to keep the amounts of vehicles to a fun level, as a shitload of ever retreating and selfrepairing vehicles is one of the 2 main reasons i stopped playing. Downfall already has quite the income for the ideal amount of players it was designed for. Starting res doesn't influence that very much though so fine.

I never finished flat, you can add it but then never link my name to it ;-) When (if) Kidpaler finishes Echelon i'll have done the five first letters of the alphabet, with Fury being the map i'm currently working on. No room for another F-map ^_^
Just think flat needs some love to get to official levels.

Ward also seems too unpolished imo. I'd also prefer not linking my name to it if you make it official. The only detailed bit is the center base flasche made for me.

Also put everyone on Echelon (except me) and replace escort with it if you really want to get rid of it
Had insane fun on Escort though, from the first hour the game got released a decade ago. It got played a lot, the adrenaline rush was insane. I think it has a place. It should have. What went wrong with it over the years that made it so unpopular?

 

I think it's still the same but I don't have a problem with it.

As a rule I like maps to start with at least 300 resources so you can place at least one barracks and one refinery.
Keep in my, for the resource income, I am also advocating removing the infernal "player resource multiplier" from the game. And as you can see on this spreadsheet I have set your map to have only the default income, so tank spam is not a problem as far as my server is concerned.

I think Flat does a decent job at a low population map, it's decently open with some cover from the trees and a few small elevation changes. Could it be more polished? sure. Does it need to be? I don't think so.

It's true that ward would use more polishing overall, There's also the fact that middle while having a base like you said, has no point of interest. However the layout and feel is good as far as I'm concerned. I will add some stuff to "required to be official".

I never really liked escort or any assault maps in the first place, it's not what Empires is about. But if you want more precise reasons, I would say the main one is the decrease in players' skill level.

 

I agree it's not what it is about, and there shouldn't be too much of them, however a little variation keeps everything fresh. After 5 or 6 strategic, long walk/few people maps, having a high intensity combat map sometimes felt necessary for me. Apart from main building placement these maps still offer everything empires should be known for as well: infantry classes and combat, vehicle combat and modularity, squad play and bonuses, turret/wall/camera/radar placements, ... Scout squad hide was awesome in escort, as were some other squad bonuses that are just way more usefull in these smaller, more intense levels. Escort in particular showed that the core combat of the game was very good on it's own.
And then after a high intensity slaughtermap, the regular empires maps would also be fun again for another 5 or 6 maps in a row.

To me it's just healthy variation, certainly not the focus
If you don't eat rice from time to time, you'll get bored eating potatoes much quicker ;-)

 

While I do agree about "cooldown" or "change of pace" maps escort is way too long for that. I have been doing cooldown maps from time to time after 2 or 3 1 hour commander maps, but I never make them last longer than 10 minutes.
I think commander maps are way more intense that escort has ever been.

 

Then i'm afraid you never played an escort match as it was designed for. The adrenaline rushes i experienced in that map i never experienced anywhere else, in any game, ever. When we were down to the last flag, hanging in there, with victory in sight yet defeat around every corner as well ... that was just insane. My heart could barely deal with it. Actions and decissions in milliseconds, an artillery strike at the tank that just parked itself on the flag, a shower of nades thrown down cause you can almost be certain they're using mass hide to reach that last flag. It all came down to milliseconds and efficiency of the entire team. I adored every part of escort except for the middle area (after S-bend). The infantry combat, class system, squad system, ... it worked so beautifully together to make a gamemode that had a much more stable core to it than the regular gamemode itself. Oh yes i loved it a lot

Mind you it's true it wasn't like that the last ... idk ... 6-8 years or so. Not all changes were for the better, and the community ... well 99% of us have become undeserving idiots by now. Which is why i'm not against removing it, but the gamemode has it's use as a real map, not just a 10 minute gimmick. Even as just a "break" from comm maps, it should be of high enough quality to be a real thing on it's own. If escort isn't up for it anymore because of changes to the game or the community, i'd love to see it replaced one day by another, modern assault map.

True, easer said than done

C'mon kidpaler! You can do it!

 

Well no I played escort many years ago in the "golden age" of Empires, just never cared for it.

 

Okay, then look at it like this. At least I myself wouldn't have been here today if it wasn't for escort, so you'd lose players

I think it was the very first map to get played on game release wasn't it? It took some time to download, install and load but once i was in escort was on. Fell in love with it right there.

 

im against including maps because it balloons up the download size which is already high enough for a game like this
also you said you want more maps included so they dont get lost but then say remove the infantry maps soooo.....


i know this post is full with strawmen and ad hominoms but please refute my arguments with logic

 

lol I don't have to refute anything, some maps should get lost in time. Don't try your bullshit on me.

Download size is already high enough? What kind of shit internet do you have that's it high? it takes me less than 5 minutes do download the game. 4 GB is nothing nowadays. Please join us in the 21st century.

 

its pretty shit. and im in a first world country.

imagine how bad it must be for other countries..

 

Oh yeah you're right I forgot about all those African kids who want to play Empires...
Keep trying...

 

A lot of these maps can not be included as "official". As far as I know, if someone works on a map for someone and they haven't signed the contributors agreement, that map can not be made official.

Oh god. Pressure.

 

I think you're confusing the word "can't" with "won't because of a meaningless document on which anyone can put a fake name and signature".

As far as I know none of the maps are copyrighted, therefore anyone and everyone is free to work on them AND to include them in a game.

 

Okay well, I'm telling you of the procedure right now and I'm also telling you they won't be included for that very reason. Nothing can be done to fix it unless you can track down the makers of every single map and get them to sign that document.

edit: I believe massacred was going to become official, but Varbles never finished it. Official maps have no _rc1 or _b1 though, so when a map has those in their name it indicates the map wasn't finished or ready for full on release.

 

Again, with the confusing of words "can" and "will" are not the same word. Plenty can be done.

Oh, so you speak for all the map makers now?

 

Welp, sorry we apparently don't see eye to eye on this but nothing can be done. Call me out on my use of that word again, I don't care. Nothing can be done unless we have their signature. The document exists for a reason.

Welp, following this handy guide on releasing a map, then yes, yes I do speak for all mappers. This is a standard that was developed and put into use by the community. I can safely say yes I do speak for all mappers on this topic. This standard exists for a reason, and the reason is to determine which maps were officially done or not.

Edit: This standard has been around since 2009. I think pretty much every map follows this standard. Sure there may be some anomalies, but for the most part I believe all of these listed aren't.

 

Nothing more annoying than downloading a game, joining a server and downloading more stuff.
When the files are included in steam, one can at least do something else. Having to download individual maps from the server each time they come up will for sure piss some people off.