Tank Aiming

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by Mikleo, May 1, 2017.

  1. Mikleo

    Mikleo Member

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    Anyone who has played on the latest patch in an actual proper game knows how annoying and confusing the system currently is.

    I am going to premise this with saying that I haven't got anything against slower moving turrets and I like the fact that you can look up etc. but the implementation is really difficult to play a real game with.

    The main problem is even when your aim is stationary the red crosshair will never match the blue one. Depending on distance it might be a little below or a lot below it. So I have to move my blue crosshair up to compensate for this. This means that I have to train my mind to ignore this enormous blue crosshair on the screen and focus on the small red one.

    The blue crosshair should be considered as my aim. I shouldn't have to try and ignore it. The red crosshair should always match the blue one exactly when the turret isn't moving. My tank is capable of aiming where my blue crosshair is looking, but I need to move my blue aim higher than the target to achieve that.

    Imagine playing as infantry and the center screen crosshair isn't the place my character is shooting but it's this other random crosshair moving around slightly below it.
     
  2. VulcanStorm

    VulcanStorm Developer Staff Member Moderator

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    The red crosshair is actually where your barrel is pointing, so where you would hit if you shot, whereas the blue one is in the centre of your view.
    I've noticed this disjoint effect when firing from behind a wall most of all, and i agree, the giant blue one is off-putting.
     
  3. Mikleo

    Mikleo Member

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    I understand that, but it's not as though the barrel is not capable of pointing where I'm aiming. I just have to aim higher to achieve that.

    I mean can't you just raytrace where my aim is looking and make sure the barrel is aiming at that position?
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
  4. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    The blue crosshair looks too dominant. One thing that should be done to this dual-crosshair setup is reducing the visual importance of the new crosshair. I assume making it transparent would help with that a fair bit.

    I have yet to play with it though, so I don't know how exactly it handles...
     
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  5. Mikleo

    Mikleo Member

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    Yea the blue crosshair is a little too big but it should be dominant. It should be your aim and you shouldn't be required to try and ignore it.
     
  6. VulcanStorm

    VulcanStorm Developer Staff Member Moderator

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    That is exactly not what happens. The barrel does should point at that position. We then do a raytrace, and show the red crosshair where it hits... It's because your view origin is higher than the barrel's origin.


    Terrible paint drawing to illustrate what i mean :)
    upload_2017-5-1_14-47-22.png
    Sadly, there isn't much we can do about the actual crosshair being stationary, since it should go wherever the tank barrel actually would hit. But i think a colour change is needed.

    EDIT: Apparently i am mistaken, and our tanks do not do this, text amended as appropriate.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
  7. Mikleo

    Mikleo Member

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    I understand that completely. Lets say that wall was higher for a second and you aim at the wall. Your tank barrel should go higher to aim where the raytrace from your aim is hitting on the wall. That doesn't happen in the game. tank.png

    In the actual game your barrel aim is way down below where it should be. You get close to any objects close up and the barrel will aim miles below where you're aiming even though the barrel is capable of moving up further.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
  8. VulcanStorm

    VulcanStorm Developer Staff Member Moderator

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    Indeed, it seems i am mistaken, our tanks have a parallel view angle instead of "looking" where you're aiming

    Here's another terrible paint picture!
    upload_2017-5-1_15-6-58.png

    This is the current behaviour right? It is parallel to the view, rather than pointing at the view. I don't like it how it is now, and we'll see about changing it :)
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
  9. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    none of those pictures are accurate, this isn't how it works...
    Both of you are forgetting about the aiming assist.

    The main problem with the tank aiming right now is that it's free look. Which is fucking stupid. If you really want free look add a keybinding for it. But leave the fucking aim alone.
    And if you can't figure how to slow down turret rotation and not have free look, THEN DON'T DO IT!
    And you also somehow managed to make it so we can't aim down anymore, making it EVEN HARDER for AFVs to hit LTs, good job!
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
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  10. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    My assumption was keeping the red crosshair as the point at which your tank is actually aiming and the blue crosshair as the center of your screen.
     
  11. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    You do realise that's what it is? right now.
     
  12. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    ...hence the word "keeping"?
     
  13. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    I must have missed something because I have no idea what you're trying to say.
     
  14. Mikleo

    Mikleo Member

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    I am pretty sure "aiming assist" just does a raytrace to detect where your shot will actually hit. Unless your aiming over a wall or something that your barrel doesn't have direct line of sight the red crosshair will be very very close to where you actually aim. Unlike now where the red crosshair is always in the wrong place 100% of the time. If you get close to a wall with a tank you will see that the barrel doesn't pitch up to match your aim. The red crosshair shows where it will hit yes, but if your barrel aimed in the right place the red crosshair and blue crosshair would match.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
  15. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    Isn't the blue crosshair kinda big? Why would you want a big inaccurate crosshair?
     
  16. VulcanStorm

    VulcanStorm Developer Staff Member Moderator

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    We have aim assist? Also, i'll see about fixing this.
     
  17. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    Ugh, do I really need to make a video of aiming assit? I'm too fucking lazy...

    there, aiming assist.



    The truth is it's impossible to tell how much they've really broken because we can't just swap installs for 2.12 anymore so can't do proper comparison.
    BUT, it's really fucking shit, that's for sure.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2017
  18. Mikleo

    Mikleo Member

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    Yes I understand that the red crosshair shows where your barrel raytrace will hit. And yes it can be different from your freelock aim and it can jump around. But that is not the cause of the main issue here. If you look at a wall close up you will see that your barrel could aim up to match where your blue crosshair is but it does not. If it were corrected the red crosshair would always stay very very close to the blue one unless you were aiming over a wall or something.
     
  19. VulcanStorm

    VulcanStorm Developer Staff Member Moderator

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    @Xyaminou That is what you mean by aim assist? I thought that was "decent tank aiming" considering we're not an infantryman, not an aim assist...

    The infantry shoot from the middle of the screen, tanks don't... hence a dynamic crosshair was required, i didn't think that was "aim assist"...
     
  20. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    Yeah I know, the aiming assist is just the part where I aim at the sky and then at concrete, or same when aiming at the barracks.
    Like I said, it's hard to grasp how much they've fucked it up, but the answer is leaning toward, "A FUCK TON!".
     

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