State of Empires.

Discussion in 'General' started by bunnyhopper, Dec 20, 2017.

  1. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    A good game?

    To put it short, it's a good game if, during the game, I can have something to do something with me, against something.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  2. Grantrithor

    Grantrithor Member

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    I was watching some old videos of scrims and pugs and had forgotten the times when I would join a game and everyone would know each other and be social, instead of how now in modern games I get put on a team of random strangers who then treat me like shit. On rising storm 2 I regularly play on only one or two servers and they have their own community of regular players. It's nice that somewhere in this brave new world that kind of spirit still exists.

    That was a nice thing about this game, but I don't really want to play it. It's definitely not about balance - I played hundreds of hours in patches where only 1 armor was worth researching or only 1 engine was useful, or always playing on slaughter and district. If those factors were really so impactful I wouldn't have put as much time as I wanted to into the game.

    I think the factors are partly what predator put forward - people were looking for total conversion mods in an era before free to play games were so pervasive (ie. they were only really looking for "free" games to try out for a couple hours and see if they like ). People come and go just the volume is much much smaller. Steamcharts indicates that peak player counts haven't changed much over the years but the average playercount isn't doing so well due to no one playing during the weekdays. Do people really want to put time into a game they have to wait 5 days at a time to play?

    Those factors may be focused more on attraction and short term retention, but the lack of (very) long term retention is due to other reasons. My hypothesis is that those who no longer play but have put time into this game are, simply put, just not interested in the game anymore for a variety of reasons. Some people might feel they have nothing else to achieve in the game - they've done it all and seen everything; others don't wish to deal with the time commitment a relationship with the game requires like organizing scrims, pugs, and clans; their old friends no longer play, or over time they started to not enjoy the people they have been playing with; people got onto this game in their late highschool/early uni days and now have bigger commitments; etc.

    There's really tons of reasons that aren't just "the devs/maps/balance/noobs/server moderation", and though I can't give a cogent argument for these I have a gut feeling the state of empires comes down to more than just a question of the game itself being bad (although the sound effects I heard last year were awful and I hope they were removed for this game's sake). My reason for not playing? I don't know, it's just a feeling that I have, but it's probably that I just want to experience things that aren't this game. I'm a different person today than I was 9 years ago when I first picked up this game, and I feel like that personal development happened to all of our good friends who have come and gone.

    Another scrim league would be fun though.
     
  3. Señor_Awesome

    Señor_Awesome Member

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    Chiming in as well, cause why not. Much of the reason this game was/is so attractive to me is the social aspect of it.

    I used to get on once a day and just kind of check in. Say hi, talk about the news, help somebody pull off something stupid, or even pull off something stupid of my own. I played this game for years before I had a mic - because I was young but also intelligent enough to know that nobody could tell and give me shit unless I got a mic. But during that time before I had a mic the conversations were just as active as after I finally got one.

    Now... I guess the reason I don't play is because I can't justify the time except the occasional weekend. Even then there's usually only 3 or 4 people on who will actually hold casual conversations. I dunno. I kind of think of most of you guys as good friends, and that's what usually brings me back. But life is, well, life. If I want the $$$ I can't goof around like I used to. And I want the $$$.

    Kind of rambled but eh. I guess I didn't really have a point, but if I may inject one here at the end, my point is I played the game because of the community. As much as we joke about how toxic it is or was, for the average person just playing pub games it was one of the best.
     
  4. JustGoFly

    JustGoFly Member

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    You are no longer allowed to socialize in this game. Play with anonymous players or get out. And that is the current plan to rebuild the population base.
     
  5. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

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    that's exactly why I always kept VIPER's spectate open against some complaints and why thecreeper did the same with NUBS. I agree and know 1/2 of the attraction to this game is specpires. I changed ESB to have spectate always open months ago. Unfortunately there are not many players to chat with anymore.
     
  6. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    As far as I'm concerned, that's a gameplay problem, where the game itself isn't fun enough to play. Which is a critical flaw, particularly if it doesn't translate into good viewership numbers on Twitch/YouTube/so forth.
     
  7. Ranger

    Ranger Member

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    Then it is settled. We must all move to VR Chat.
     
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  8. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    I would agree with this if it was newer players(1-4 months), but it's mostly older players who spec stack. From my view people sit in spec because it's a small community, so they know who's fun to play with, who does teamwork, and how hopeless it is to play for a side. I definitely fall in that last category, I just don't feel like even trying anymore against hopeless or really tedious situations. For the other 2 if they don't see what they like they know it's not going to be a fun time even if they could win, so they just don't bother. And of course long rounds of empires is draining so they just take a break for the map.

    This is disregarding the people who sit in spec because they went afk or need to do something in the background(homework or whatever) and just use it as a chat room. Also the people who just don't like the map, that is a game play problem for them. Point is spec is used for a lot of reasons.
     
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  9. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

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    I believe it has to do with its a small community and everyone knew everyone else and also playing several comm maps in a row can be tiring and players needed a break. Instead of leaving the server they hung out in spectate for a map or 2, whether it be going afk or just chatting to take a break.
     
  10. JustGoFly

    JustGoFly Member

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    Resources are so restricted we spend twice as much time looking at our calculators, not having fun. When you play with nubs, they have to build or they are shit. You can't afford to have one nub not building, because resources are the life blood. Now research requires resources, so all you can afford to do is research turret upgrade and greatly delay dropping a VF or people push paper tanks, and you never get enough resources to research armor or engine. Who is making this game so unfun?

    Give us back our resources, lets focus on fighting, not building. Damn it's been gone for so long that very few people remember the good times when we didn't have to build every refinery or care that we had less than half the resources on the map.

    Proposal to make the game simple for nubs, which will keep them in the game:
    Provide an ALTERNATE Com panel, and an ALTERNATE VF panel, that asks you many questions (wizards have been around forever). Note I am NOT asking for you to mess up what works today, I'm asking for a SECONDARY selection:
    1. What vehicle would you like : Jeep - xx resources, light tank/AFV, APC, each with a description of what they are used for.
    2. What armor would you like: explain each, Icon over the not researched armors (Not available until the commander researchs), making them unavailable. Explain what Reactive, Regen, Absorbant ... is good against - positives and negatives.
    3. What gun would you - like - "choosing too many weapons for your tank, will reduce the number of plates of armor".
    Then auto fit the armor of choice, with the proper number of plates on each side. Don't make them increase decrease plates - do it automagically.
    Ask: Confirm or go back and change something ?

    Every nub would use it - some Vet's might whip though it, or they would use the OTHER and current option to quickly build a tank. When the advanced option is no longer used, retire it. Stop changing what works, because you have a brilliant idea, and focus on what is broken.

    Same for research - a SECONDARY selection, stop messing with what we have memorized. Setup a list of commonly researched items and only give a few options that would work on most maps:
    1. Speed - for open maps,
    2. Choke neck research,
    3. a mix of the two.
    Then the com simply presses the research button and whatever is in that list gets researched, one button press at a time. No thinking or knowledge of the game required.
    And we know the list above is different for NF vs BE. Now anyone can command, and they get to focus on the team, not browsing menus and guessing what would work for the map.
    Now the knowledge embedded in every good com is free to every new player to use.

    Vicki - ESB should have higher resource flow. It makes the game more fun. Let X mod his server into oblivion.
     
  11. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Best I can do you right now is better official vehicle loadout files, with builds that actually work in the current meta instead of random junk (LT with std MG only yeee). The question is, how useful would that even be in the first place? I bet most if not all people, even around here, use a single vehicle loadout they modify whenever new research is available.

    What ESB needs above all else is a fixed mapvote plugin that has 2 voting stages, letting a map win with 30~% of votes is extremely frustrating.
     
  12. MegaMLGgaming

    MegaMLGgaming Member

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    Ok heres my two cents on this.

    The resource thing, if most people agree on keeping it. Half the res cost, it really stings when you can't place or push anything. If not remove it entirely.

    And on the better vehicle selection/customisation screen for nubs that JGF was talking about.
    Heres a fun fact. I've been playing this game since 2011 and i didn't find out that i could change goddamn armor and engines untill ALMOST 3 YEARS into it.
    I mean i was pretty goddamn young but hell, a tutorial would have helped. I never noticed those goddamn customisation tabs. We really need to get those vf and cv tutorials out. All i would think is, enter big factory, press e on big screen, get default tank and die. Didnt think anything of it untill somebody told me about it. And it only took 3 years.

    I know it sounds retarded, but thats the truth, it's whats happening to all the newbies.
     
  13. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Shameless plug time since I'm fairly certain this is the best thing we have in this respect right now. Keep it in mind if you happen upon a newbie struggling with the vehicle menu.
     
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  14. JustGoFly

    JustGoFly Member

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    VICKI - could we put live links to some of the DDD training videos on the MOTD ?
    Destroyer - do you have a landing page that organizes the various levels of training?
    New - bare basics,
    Been playing for 100 hours - here are some more tips

    I told someone I've played with for years about Squad Arty the other day and he was dumb founded that he didn't know it.

    We also need an explanation of Squad Lead and why it's appropriate to give it up on occasion, and if you are doing well expect to get it back, or ask for it back.
    What happens now is the new players think you are demoting them and they take offense. They don't know what to do with it but it think that their squad will follow them and do what they say just because they are squad lead. They need to know that they are the ones working for the squad, not the other way around.
     
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  15. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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  16. Sgt.Security

    Sgt.Security Member

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    Reminds me of the "couch theory" by Paradox.

    Basically, we are just here to sit with friends, chatting and watching TV.
     
  17. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

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    yes on both counts fly..sorry I haven't been around much. I will do it now
     
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