Official Scout Change Thread

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by DonMegel, Sep 19, 2009.

?

What do you think?

  1. Do this as it is

    5 vote(s)
    20.0%
  2. Do this with just a few changes

    13 vote(s)
    52.0%
  3. Don't do this

    7 vote(s)
    28.0%
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  1. -=SIP=-

    -=SIP=- Member

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    Effective Snipers in Empires: No

    Maps are too open and it's very easy to hide yourself.
    If you want to shoot people from distance then use NFHR or BEcar. If you want to be a sniper play counter strike (and guess why they don't have open maps)

    So just give the scout pistol 2 until we have models for the shotgun.
     
  2. zynaps

    zynaps Member

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    I don't know. It might make more people choose scout over riflemen or grenadiers when the base is under attack because they want to "have more wallhack capabilities". Move this to the binoculars instead.

    How does the jammer work? If you look with the binocs at an enemy engy radar or camera they stop functioning? Can you jam the main radar as well by simply spotting it from a kilometer away? That would be a bit too overpowered i think. Short range radar power with appropriate skill set: Approved :)

    Anything that makes the binocs useful gets my approval. Not sure about 1/4 points. Needs testing, might have to be raised i think ;)

    Too powerful in this form. How about artillery and grenadiers gets a hint in which direction and angle they should aim. That way not every shell strikes the target but instead they come real close and might hit. An aiming circle could appear on screen. Aim with the cross hair into this circle and you will hit in the target vicinity. The binoc spam needs to go and be replaced with a beep or similarly short signal.

    Sound good too me, but make it a skill or another pistol weapon (dartgun?) thus forcing the scout to go for a real pistol or a dart gun, but cannot have both at the same time.

    Sound good too. Could be a permanent skill?

    Already exists as a skill? What about giving the scout more points for stuff so he can gain points quicker and thus select more skills. But i don't see a problem with having it being a permanent skill either.

    I don't like this. What happens when you sabotage the commander? I think sabotage is fine as it is now but needs some tweaking. I'd rather see that sabotage would not bleed all buildings. Here's a chart:

    - Rax sab: Building health reduced to 50%, spawn health reduced to 50%, 5 minute bleed time until destruction of the building.
    - VF sab: Building health reduced to 50%, various problems with spawned vehicles like the possibility of wrong armor, engine and weapons. No bleed.
    - Radar sab: Building health reduced to 50%, No bleed. Research time doubled. Radar spots the other team.
    - Ref sab: Same as now.
    - Armory sab: Building health reduced to 50%, No bleed, Armory can give ammo to both teams while sabotaged.
    - Repair sab: Building health reduced to 50%, 5-10 minute bleed time. Vehicles can only repair up to 90% of their hull strength.

    A delay between the moment of sabotage and an engineer being able to repair the building could be introduced; say 10-20 seconds long?

    No, you should be able to select a more traditional weapon as well. Only a shotgun would make you useless for ranged combat at the front line together with the rest of your squad. You'd have to hide until overrun by the enemy to use it at which time your entire squad is most likely dead. The shotgun would only be good on certain maps where CQB is more common or if you are close to an enemy spawn point or base.

    I'm skeptical; Anti personnel mines should be the grenadiers job, their regular mines does a good job at this already. How powerful should the timed explosives be? Can they destroy a sabotaged building? If limited to one per spawn it's fine, i don't think you should be able to restock on timed explosives from an armory or an ammo box though.

    I don't see this accomplishing anything really :/

    Of course ;)

    Some additions:

    - Scouts could be able to remove the sabotage from sabotaged friendly buildings (without repairing them)?
    - Sticky stun bombs (or a new 4th type of grenade) should break down fully built enemy walls ?
    - Scouts staying in the squad leader aura (if the squad leader is a non scout) gets an armor buff.
    - Dead enemies should not be able to see the scout who killed them?
    - A commander placed target lock is removed when a scout hides?
    - When crouched and hidden, beginning to sprint before standing up lets you hide while sprinting until stamina runs out? Crouching before the stamina runs out will let you recharge the stamina again, all without ever having to expose yourself.
    - Shader based hide skill anyone???
     
  3. RoboTek

    RoboTek Member

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    Clearly not. That said, I agree with most of your concepts, but not on one key point.

    You think too much of the wall-hacks. Not because you think it is more useful than it is, the ability is very useful. Not because you think it might make people take scouts, because it will. The reason is that commanders already can, and are expected to give free wall-hacks to all of their players anyway. This is a key defining capability of the game and to most dull and monotonous task for a commander ever. We already have the capability, giving it to scouts instead of commanders, or tying it in to scouts somehow, improves gameplay by granting more tactical elements to the players. Additionally, it merely grants the class a use, a use no greater than building walls or being good at killing infantry.

    Ideally, I see all tactical gameplay being in the realm of individual players, while all strategic decisions are made by commanders. Currently, this would be very little, but call it a long-term goal.
     
  4. Reef

    Reef Member

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    Again, how about one change to scout?

    F.e. sabotaging enemy radar gives intelligence about the enemy research. Easy to implement, but do We want that? I don't think so. It would encourage scouts to sneak to enemy radar.

    Is there any single change to scout that (almost) everyone agrees to?
     
  5. Trickster

    Trickster Retired Developer

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    Mashav's with my edits + omneh's sab idea. Kthx.
     
  6. RoboTek

    RoboTek Member

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    Any single change that everyone can agree upon?

    That would be a shotgun, as far as I know.

    I am pretty sure that a 10% base speed increase would also be generally well-received.
     
  7. Reef

    Reef Member

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    Trickster: so what would You leave from it? It seems like You are against (and have reasonable arguments) on most of his ideas.

    About omneh's idea, could You say that (forgetting about special flashy-soundy effects for a while) it would be a device that works like bio? If building is under it's effect, it just gets damage over time?
    Should it recharge after it's done or die or what?
    About special effects: BE could have a nanobot-bomb and NF could have a bacteria-infecter or something. Or it could look just like X and sound like Y, whatever.
     
  8. Dubee

    Dubee Grapehead

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    I think the scout needs to maintain anti building ability's.
     
  9. DonMegel

    DonMegel Member

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    New thread created with new changes. This one is now locked.
     
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