McD vs KFC scrim - Saturday 5th July 21:00 BST/4pm EDT/1pm PDT - McD signups here!

Discussion in 'General' started by Trickster, Jun 29, 2014.

  1. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    4,827
    Likes Received:
    190
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Why can't we just play empires? That's all I want to do...:(
     
  2. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    13,299
    Likes Received:
    168
    Trophy Points:
    0
    the times when it still was about empires are long gone ...
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2014
  3. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

    Messages:
    7,036
    Likes Received:
    36
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It was always like this, but far more malicious back then.

    This considerably tame to the backlog of shit on this hate train.

    The attitude era of empires was great but everyone was an asshole.
    I was only a babby way back when and I wished I was more active during the time.
     
  4. McGyver

    McGyver Experimental Pedagogue

    Messages:
    6,533
    Likes Received:
    31
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I enjoy the drama here. Totally worth doing a 'low intensity DDOS without a botnet'.
     
  5. Grantrithor

    Grantrithor Member

    Messages:
    9,820
    Likes Received:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Because homing salvo isn't 2 slot anymore.
     
  6. complete_

    complete_ lamer

    Messages:
    6,438
    Likes Received:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    0
    had the same problem. version seems borked, i guess
     
  7. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

    Messages:
    7,036
    Likes Received:
    36
    Trophy Points:
    0
    We spent a few minutes cursing about revive being broken and giving candles shit.

    I thought it was funny.
     
  8. Lawliet

    Lawliet Member

    Messages:
    869
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I have my recording from hours before the scrim so I may be able to prove the server was choppy before anyone joined.

    As for low-intensity DDoS, you don't need a botnet to DDoS. You can do it with a single server. We should stray away from this talk about DDoS since the only experts on the subject are ponies and IT people.

    As for McDonald's, I am willing to take over as long as I get the cooperation of the players.
     
  9. vipervicki

    vipervicki Member

    Messages:
    2,611
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Candles now has access to restarting the PUG server, plus changing the server password and cvars, which he already had.

    I will also ask AZK to monitor the server during PUGS/scrims for any possible attacks, glitches, lag, choppiness etc, if I am not available. If he is not able to I will give that access to someone else if I am not around for the event.

    But I am asking the coordinators of the events to let me know days ahead of an upcoming event, the rules to it, if cfgs or passwords need changing, if its a private or vet event etc etc. It puts me at a huge disadvantage if I am not aware of all or many of these points.

    Several of the people in the events were given regular server admin on PUG server previously.

    Anything else I need covered?

    FYI: We had close to 40 people last night (Sunday) on VIPER and server ran smoothly and no one got disconnected the time I was in there. (this is in response to someone posting VIPER had issues the day the scrim was on (Saturday).
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2014
  10. Neoony

    Neoony Member

    Messages:
    1,370
    Likes Received:
    106
    Trophy Points:
    0
    EDIT: Read edit first! (bottom of the post)

    Yeah, Iam pretty sure the lag was PUG server specific. I was playing on viper at same time as I didnt play the first round of the scrim. No problems.

    But some lag been happening last few pugs. (didnt noticed any problems in viper public at all and also never ever noticed issue similar to this in any game, it isnt usual lag)

    Starts with some people (only some) unable to hear anybody clearly (voice).
    Then it switches to another group of people and the ones that couldnt hear anything before start saying that its ok, while the other group starts complaining.
    Many times there was group of people saying that they cant hear anything while I could hear them or anybody else just fine and then after some time (or next time/next round) it started happening for me (couldnt hear anybody) while others happily communicating.

    Its probably the same for the game lag (not voice).

    Then I dont know if it always just dissapeared instantly or maybe it still affected some people throughout the PUG. But didnt seen any complaints later in the match.

    This whole thing was usually only noticable at the start of any rounds.
    And it might be related to the ammount of people connected/connecting (maybe not, just know that somebody was saying that he was playing on the viper pug server with smaller group before pug and didnt had any problems, but it usually starts when everybody connects and are ready to play).
    Actually I think I didnt noticed it happening when we were only setting things up, always seems to start when everything is ready xD

    EDIT: lol, I never watched the video of that scrim. ( now I did xD ) The one in the video looks nothing like what I was saying. Doesnt seem the same, I was only trying to say that there were some problems before...but never seen anything like this.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2014
  11. Grantrithor

    Grantrithor Member

    Messages:
    9,820
    Likes Received:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Pardon my pedantic autism, but then it's not a DDOS, it's just a DOS.
     
  12. FN198

    FN198 Member

    Messages:
    2,434
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    A lot of things combined to make it too fishy to feel fair. Trickster has paid lots of money to keep his server online all these years and would much prefer to play on it. Also, his team was warming up on EPIC's server. At the surface this is totally benign, but any gamer knows that it's best to train for a game on the latency that it will occur on. He could have had his players warm up on the VIPER public server, or even the pug server so that he could test the waters and get a feel for the timings. He also knew that there wasn't anyone available to analyze traffic at the time. According to Trickster, unless you own a server you shouldn't pick it for your scrims. What better opportunity, when his rival doesn't own the server he wants to play on and doesn't have any power to defend it, to add evidence to support his position and get to play on the server that he pays for?

    There is no way to determine who the botter was. Not even a confession could confirm who executed the attack or why. The only way to look at it is objectively. VIPER PUG works fine, and has worked fine for the last couple of months. In its history, it has never needed more than a changelevel to work well. Most often Hanlon's razor should apply (the case in which the server could have actually been misconfigured), but in this case the server had the same settings that handled a 16v16 with additional spectators just a week ago.

    Strategically, incapacitating the server was low hanging fruit for Trickster. First, it makes VIPER PUG so laggy that it's unplayable for many people, and just barely playable for others. Say, going from parallel parking with power steering to manual steering. If you were parallel parking with manual steering all along, there's no problem doing either. If you weren't used to flexing on the wheel before, though, then you will have a considerably difficult time adjusting. Trickster as well as Paradox and Sgt Security know that EPIC's team is much more well adjusted to that than KXIC's. So this subtle, otherwise egalitarian seeming disadvantage was not equally felt throughout each team.

    More importantly, even if both rounds were played on VIPER PUG and the server performs horribly it's still boon for EPIC. They could (they are) talk shit about how bad VIPER is for pugs and paint this incident as a precedent for holding future scrims on EPIC. I tried raising the attacker one by holding our ground and deciding to play on VIPER PUG, hoping that the attack would subside after I made it clear that we were not going to join EPIC. As you can see in Jephir's video, it did not stop. At that moment I realized how obvious it would've been if it did stop at that moment. If the attacker's goal was to smear VIPER PUG, there's no better opportunity than to force two teams to play a severely stuttered match on it. So if stutters during spec aren't enough to get me to change my decision, stutter throughout every second of gametime should be more persuasive. Knowing I wasn't in a position to call out the attack, the packet loss kept coming. Essentially, I raised the attacker one, and then they raised again, calling my bluff and forcing us to fold.
     
  13. Candles

    Candles CAPTAIN CANDLES, DUN DUN DUN, DUN DUN DUN DUN.

    Messages:
    4,251
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    0
  14. Jephir

    Jephir ALL GLORY TO THE JEPHIR

    Messages:
    1,409
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    0
    [​IMG]
     
  15. Neoony

    Neoony Member

    Messages:
    1,370
    Likes Received:
    106
    Trophy Points:
    0
    After watching the video..
    Should this have even started with this kind of lag?
    ..even if it would finish, could you consider a Scrim with this kind of lag actually a Scrim?
    :confused:

    Doesnt matter if it was the same for both sides. You cant even possibly know that.

    You just dont play a match with this lag. :pathetic:

    oh and this whole thing:

    is ridiculous XD :D ^^
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2014
  16. FN198

    FN198 Member

    Messages:
    2,434
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You're right to raise those questions. I agree with Spartacus, making the conditions clear and cancelling if things aren't right is better than trying to play through them. I wanted to cancel it, but I wanted to play more. Then I realized how silly it was to try and play with the lag.
     
  17. Trickster

    Trickster Retired Developer

    Messages:
    16,576
    Likes Received:
    46
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I almost deleted this post thinking it was MrDee copy pasta.
     
  18. Grantrithor

    Grantrithor Member

    Messages:
    9,820
    Likes Received:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    0
    This whole post
    [​IMG]
     
  19. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    13,299
    Likes Received:
    168
    Trophy Points:
    0
    someone is taking something more serious then its healthy ...
     
  20. FN198

    FN198 Member

    Messages:
    2,434
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Oftentimes the truth is stranger than fiction.
     

Share This Page