Escort is broken

Discussion in 'General' started by Private Sandbag, Dec 23, 2008.

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  1. Private Sandbag

    Private Sandbag Member

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    Escort is pretty much unplayable. The res means that on pub games it's almost impossible to get the first flag.
     
  2. petemyster

    petemyster Member

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    truely, it is very very bad. Trickster had to give us 30000 res and extra tickets, and we only just about demolished the barricades allowing us to travel to the 2nd flag.
     
  3. -Mayama-

    -Mayama- MANLY MAN BITCH

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    ITS BROKEN LIKE UR MOM D:
     
  4. Satanchild666

    Satanchild666 Banned

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    Dude, escort is broken, used to be broken and always will be BROKEN
     
  5. arklansman

    arklansman Member

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    It has a refinery for BE in 2.21.
     
  6. Satanchild666

    Satanchild666 Banned

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    Wich will then suffer of the humiliating and obliterating NF mortar shells.
     
  7. mr_quackums

    mr_quackums Member

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    his mom doesnt have enough res or tickets?

    back to escort: instead of just giving BE more res, the first NF spawn should disappear or be moved or some sort of delay between getting from spawn to combat (a winding corridor to run down or something).

    i say just have them spawn at second flag and beef up the automated defenses (a lvl3 instead of lvl1 turret) to stop BE from just waling to the flag. its more elegant than just giving BE more starting res, keeps the rest of the map the same (unlike a higher res rate for BE), and makes it so BE cant just keep up the rush to go from flag 1 to last final in 1 move.
     
  8. arklansman

    arklansman Member

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    Only if NF have noclip. :rolleyes:
     
  9. Metal Smith

    Metal Smith Member

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    Really, it takes some amount of teamwork to get any flags on escort. If you have that team work, NF is pretty much fucked.

    Unfortunately, NF is often stacked for some reason. when escort used to be hard, it was stacked for good reason, people liked the challenge.

    But yeah, Either team using teamwork when the other team doesn't usually means they one team will lose. Once, we held the last flag area for around 10~ minutes with no tickets left, thanx to a godly turret farm and 5 engineers healing the walls for 10 minutes straight.

    ^_^
     
  10. Demented

    Demented Member

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    For the most part, I think the reason BE has such a hard time now is because the APC rushes they used to rely on to effortlessly capture the first flag are no longer as effective.

    The long delay before vehicles can get out, the different vehicle handling, the different rifle behavior (for killing infantry trying to sticky the APC), and the lack of resources--if you failed an APC rush before, you could always try it again 'till you got it right--all contribute to making fast capping of the first flag impossible.

    That means that BE either has to rush the flag as infantry for a fast capture, or that they need to slowly capture it by putting the pressure hard on NF, so that it's too difficult for NF to hold and/or recap the flag. The former is less of a team effort, but it still requires a team, otherwise NF will just cap it back.
     
  11. bloodreaver

    bloodreaver Member

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    I've seen Escort won on full public games from the use of scouts capping the flags.

    Vehicles on the other hand, are pretty much useless, unless the driver is extremely good.




    But yeah, I do agree...its pretty broken.
     
  12. Solokiller

    Solokiller Member

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    I've been working on remaking escort in the past few days, it should make flag 1 a quick stop for BE. Of course, the map's balance will eventually depend on how well it is tested.
     
  13. petemyster

    petemyster Member

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    it used to work just right.
     
  14. Solokiller

    Solokiller Member

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    Well, i can't honestly see how somebody that has only played 2.12 and 2.2 can say it has always been broken. It's been changed a lot of over the years, the game has as well.
    In earlier versions the vf didn't respawn, there were no turrets guarding BE base, everything was researched, and the map was not optimised.
    To be honest it's better than ever.
     
  15. Omneh

    Omneh Member

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    I can play as rifleman on NF and only use sticky bombs and shotty pistol to kill infantry throughout the entire game and still dominate the scoreboard. Either I'm really, really good (unlikely), or something is broken which makes people camp in convenient little groups, and rush lonely APC's or heavies.
     
  16. Satanchild666

    Satanchild666 Banned

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    I played that version, and it was still broken as NF would get brutaly raped by arty and nukes.
    Meaning there was no point defending anything as you would be killed anyway.

    I like this version, aslong people don't waste resources on jeeps. Other then that it is a pretty good version.
    More infantry, less tanks. The only problem comes in that infantry can't destroy lvl3 MGs while they are being repaired by 3 engineers. Instead of increasing resources I sugest increasing the resource rate. No game on escort has ever been won without heavy tanks.

    And it is far too easy for Rifleman to sticky vehicles.
     
  17. Solokiller

    Solokiller Member

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    Well, that's what i'm going to try and adress in the new version, there will no longer be a chokepoint where vehicles can only pass through one area to get to another.
    Satanchild: have you played this version on your own or on a server? And please, shrink your signature.
     
  18. kill3rtomato

    kill3rtomato Member

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    The problem with this map is, in order for BE to capture any flag you need to have good drivers. 99% of the time, you have fail drivers that waste money on rail/plasma/shit heavies, then none of the good drivers (if any) on BE can make anything..

    Although personally, I think the map is fine with the exception of the third flag (S curve). That one is nigh impossible to capture even with good tank drivers. All NF has to do is place around 12 lvl 3 turrets (many MLs, many MGs) and BE can't get in at all. Now, it IS possible to scout in, neutral the flag and rush like hell, but honestly, 99% of the people who play this don't seem to understand the concept of rushing a flag and trying to capture it (which is why BE fails so much) so eh..

    Whatever, that's just me. I personally like the map though.
     
  19. Solokiller

    Solokiller Member

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    Well, removing the unneeded research should prevent crappy tanks. I was thinking about simply removing the S curve, it makes absolutely no sense.
     
  20. Private Sandbag

    Private Sandbag Member

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    my personal theory for the map is that it's fun when BE wins. You can have great teamwork on both teams, have a great battle, and still have BE win which means it never gets stagnant.

    Imagine the map was unbalanced such that BE usually won. In my imagination, that's what 2.12 was like because of the massive resouces, though in pub games it's easy for inexperienced players to fuck BE up, it was fun.

    It's not fun for BE and it's not fun for NF when NF is winning, because it means fighting over the same area of map for more than an hour. But it's not fun for NF either. I remember more than one game in 2.2 where NF has been saying that they're bored and in one case actually pulling their team back to the next flag to move the game along. An hour on one section of a map. that's not good pacing now is it?

    you know what you should do with this map? don't give it such a long timer that it's either "brenodi very very slowly push forward, in which case they win, or brenodi get totally stuck on one of the flags, in which case they lose". you should make it so that it's really fairly easy for brenodi to win, but the time limit is massively reduced. say, to about half of what it currently is. So the idea of NF if just to hold BE off for as long as they can and pray, pray that they can keep them from moving up until the last flag. Then, after that, the teams are switched and you go again. same length of game but twice as fast pace gameplay. That would be a LOT more fun.

    also, what the hell was wrong with this: http://forums.empiresmod.com/showthread.php?t=5191 I simply do not understand why that got veto'd by mootant.
     
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