Empires 2.52.8 Released

Discussion in 'News' started by ImSpartacus, Dec 25, 2014.

  1. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    Yeah, I get that doesn't give the clearest picture. Guess what, abs/reflective/regen/compo also don't give the clearest idea of how much it does. Reactive and budget are the only 2 armors that tell you what to expect because they only use hp and weight amounts to differentiate them form the rest. So why do you complain about that and not everything in general? I can see you like have a complete picture, I do too. Most people don't seem to really care as long as it works.

    Spartacus wants a simple sentence to give a general idea and there it is, if he wants to tack on simple resists afterwards I have no problem with that. I'm just trying to show that you can use the resist system and still give a basic idea that it does something in that one sentence.

    I assume you mean anti-missile armors? In which case there isn't any.

    If you mean things that don't fall into the missile category but are still slow, like mines and sticky grenades, well if it doesn't say anything then it doesn't affect it. Just like the current description says.

    Cost ratio isn't mentioned explicit anywhere on any armor either. You just look at the cost and make the judgement yourself, so that's an odd complaint.
     
  2. Empty

    Empty Member

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    I am complaining about everything in general

    The armor system is unintuitive, shitty and completely incomprehensible without looking at scripts.

    EDIT: and you can't make judgements yourself because you simply don't know if 2 plates costing 30 weight will cover you any better than 4 plates covering 30 weight. And you can't know unless you test it ingame or painstakingly read the scripts. The HP values might indicate one thing, but for all you know the armor has a magic 30% resist to everything which isn't documented anywhere.
     
  3. ImSpartacus

    ImSpartacus nerf spec plz

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    Aside from the speed to damage and reflective properties, there are no magical resistances anywhere.

    I removed all of the weird ones for the exact reason that you're describing.

    Yes, there are minor resists on only two armors, but they exist only to supplement issues with speed or speed to damage. If shit worked properly, they wouldn't be necessary. Therefore, I think that players won't even notice them.

    If we get a better gui, then maybe we'll go crazy with resists. Until then, I agree that they would be confusing.
     
  4. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    Ah, that's what you meant. Well I can't really disagree with you. I know before there really wasn't much of that, for the most part what you see is what you get. People really just look at the hp and weight, kinda like what they do with engines and only compare how fast it goes and how well it cools. Though it seems like some people don't even look at hp or weight to an extent, I'm always hearing about how many plates they can put on with x amount of weapons.

    Anyways if armors went into a more resist heavy type of setup which means a more hard counter approach then you are correct that it makes it a tad harder to tell how much damage an armor can actually take. Having hard values that make it easy to see how much something resists something is much better.
     
  5. Ikalx

    Ikalx Member

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    The lore lines for armours are often ignored because they are just ineffective.

    People who get armours are used to having stat bars or a little list of attributes. Check every other game that gives you the option and that's what people snap to look at. No one reads the flavour text for armours - even if it really helps you understand what it does. It's just not what they're used to, and they can't really conceive of such an obscure method for conveying information.

    Really.
     
  6. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    armor is bullshit and i dont trust the descriptions since spartacus changed the scripts
    case in point: compo still reads like the best armor
     
  7. f1r3w4rr10r

    f1r3w4rr10r Modeler

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    Guys I really don't see any true point against writing how the armors currently work into the GUI.
    The only points I've seen are either it's too complicated with the current GUI (which has already been busted) or you guys seemingly just don't want to give the player that information.
    Other than that, I REALLY don't see any point why we should not implement this improvement.
     
  8. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    The only "guys" against this is spartacus. Admittedly it makes sense he's the main one with the concern. This is directly related to what he does and is extra work for him. He's correct about worrying people not wanting to read shit either if you info dump on them.

    However I will say there's a limit to what you can do really. If people don't want to read well they probably will never read anything no matter how you word it or short you keep it. If they want to know it's right there for them. Most of us should know that how stuff works is spread by word of mouth, who are also the people most likely to read paragraphs if it can give them an edge or want to make the most out of their choices available.

    I will say the resist system is a bit more complicated then what can be related in a couple of graph bars or some radar graph, which is what most people can actually be bothered to look at. You can simplify the ideas a bit to just the main weapon categories.
     
  9. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    People don't read shit, be it vets or newbies. I had a custom motd and custom briefings for emp_nuclear, and only a few read either. Every vet, bar a select few, asked "WTF do we do here". It may be because they aren't required to read anywhere else, but it might also be that people just outright don't read.
     
  10. Z100000M

    Z100000M Vithered Weteran

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    No, its because its always filled with some random lore or stuff like "lol this map is simply |Ebic|" that noone really cares about and never has any usefull info in it, therefore noone expects anyone to actually put essential info there. You could include some intentional exploits in a classic map and upload it and noone would be the wiser.
     
  11. Empty

    Empty Member

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    I read shit, it's just in empires 90% of the shit you read is straight up false.
     
  12. complete_

    complete_ lamer

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    nobody ever asks about the ticket system on eastborough, because it is clear and concise
    its a pretty neat trick
     
  13. Ikalx

    Ikalx Member

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    I don't read the wall of text briefings that even I contributed to for maps. Mostly because I've read them before, and mostly because there's no real time to do that before you need to get in game. And they're long. I'm just glad that if someone was to read them, they'd now help them quite a lot - so people looking for help how to play the game or a map can actually read up on it in-game and get some more know-how.

    With the armour flavour texts...yeah they're short, and the one liners are kinda helpful "light, cheap armour" etc etc, but for comparisons it's just not a format that's helpful. That being said, you get a general gist of the armour/engine from it at least.
     
  14. Lazybum

    Lazybum :D Staff Member Moderator

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    Some random thought, but capacitive and reactive have pretty much the same idea behind the way they work. It might make sense to either convert reactive to be capacitive or change reactive's description. This is probably a really minor thing, but they are really similar.
     
  15. Grantrithor

    Grantrithor Member

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    I have never once in my life ever read an MOTD because it's usually just "Welcome to the AWESOMEEST TFC SERVER EVAR!!!1" and map descriptions have always been fluff so I'm conditioned to treat them all useless, since I need to get in game cause the team need sme.
     
  16. ViroMan

    ViroMan Black Hole (*sniff*) Bully

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    Yup... this.
     
  17. f1r3w4rr10r

    f1r3w4rr10r Modeler

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    Well I don't see how you can compare a wall of text lore post with literally a one liner.
     

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