emp_fury

Discussion in 'Mapping' started by Silk, May 1, 2017.

  1. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Well it's counterintuitive to have it go 1 to 5 from left to right, but not A to E from top to bottom. You'd think A1 is top left like usual.
    Also my memory doesn't work that way, it doesn't store any direct information, just methods or systems. My entire house is laid out according to the way my brains works, cause it's the only way i can find something. I can play this game for a decade (i have) but if you ask me which direction the minimap numbering goes, i will not know. Ask me again in a few months and i'll have forgotten again, i will however remember that it was done in a weird way, but not which way.
     
  2. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    It's done just like Cartesian coordinates on a grid are laid out, growing from the bottom left corner of the map :rolleyes:
     
  3. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Yes but cartesian coordinates still allow for 4 possible explanations. Only the top right part goes from bottom to top and left to right ;-)
    It's just not a way i usually come across in daily life. We write from left to right and top to bottom, all mathematical software i've ever used follows this system, like for example excel. I even order my closets this way cause if i start at the front, i can't access the back anymore :D

    Just saying, if the minimap doesn't tell, it can be interpreted in any way. The current way isn't intuitive to me personally as it's a method i rarely come across.

    Doesn't matter though, but i'm adding the gridnumbers for people like me who use intuition instead of memory. I for one could've used them yesterday
     
  4. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    cells in excel are no coordinates.
     
  5. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    True, but again, that's not how my brain works. I'm not using a compass to get to work, i don't come across use of coordinates in real life. The minimap to me is just a grid, something that can be ordered. And in my experience that has always gone from left to right, top to bottom, be that lists or arrays of data. Actually i did come across coordinates in a children's game that i would have to translate something like "submarine" where you use a grid to try to find and destroy your opponents submarines, and even that one goes from top to bottom.

    Why the big deal btw? Anyone concerned about me cluttering the minimap? It's a strategy game, information is important.
     
  6. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    nah no big deal, just sharing knowledge

    but while were at boardgames :3
    [​IMG]
     
  7. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Battleships?

    And no, I don't mind that at all, I was simply pointing out the way the mechanic works. Not all minimaps have the grid numbers along their borders, it's good to understand them without extra aids.
     
  8. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Unfortunately, my brain will never be able to store that information for longer than a few months.

    Also you guys are aware hammer and source work from top to bottom right? The main grid has no meaning in this discussion as it has a center, so half the grid goes left to right, half goes right to left, half goes top to bottom and half goes bottom to top. However every time i have to use coordinates in hammer or source, it goes top to bottom. In detail.vbsp when you specify which part of texture to use you start at the top left corner. In resource.txt when you specify the map coordinates for the minimap the top left corner of the map is (0,0) and the bottom righ corner is (18454,18454) or something. When i make the texture in fireworks it goes from top to bottom. In real life the architect plans for my land and house go from top to bottom.

    Actually i'm always insecure and started this discussion as if i was the weird one, but there's literally not a single example i can give for coordinates starting from the bottom other than the empires minimap, in my personal experience.

    Odd btw that in dutch the game is about submarines, and everywhere else it seems to be battleships. You'd think you'd be able to SEE battleships, not being submarines and all, ruining the game of guessing.
    btw: https://www.dropbox.com/s/zzdyz68i2w4inzv/Battleship-board-game-001.jpg?dl=0
     
  9. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    By the way, I forgot to record my perspective (again).

    But here is the SourceTV demo if anyone is interested.
     
  10. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Thx, i'm gonna take a look how the other groups played.
    Also probably too soon to tell, but ... shall i add a vehicleblock to the lavapits, or would that be unrealistic or unnecessary?
     
  11. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    Nah let people drive stuff in there if they want :)
     
  12. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    well hammer uses an "ordinary" right-handed cartesian coordinate system with z up. postive x extends towards right, positive y towards the top, positive z towards up.
    funny you mention texture space, there actually is a difference if you look at it from the DX and oGL perspective. directX uv-coordinates start at top left, whereas openGL starts at bottom left.
    its kinda weird source uses the directX format for detail.vbsp while it uses normal maps in openGL format (the difference is the green channel, "the y axis", thats why you often need to invert it)

    all this makes you wonder - why cant we have consistency, seriously ...
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2017
  13. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    ArmA and military maps work like the first quadrant of the Cartesian grid (bottom left -> top right).

    People should totally be allowed to melt their vehicles (and faces) in the lava ^^
     
  14. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Ok than, less work for me ^_^
    Tanks shouldn't be able to get in anyway at this point, perhaps with some effort. Even jeeps will often not get through the vehicleblockade easily. And suiciding a cv, you can do that in the water anyway.

    Fixed so far:
    - Added minimap numbering
    - Closed a mountain displacements not going into the ground allowing people to get underneath
    - Properly aligned the 3d skybox with the map terrain
    - Slightly improved BE build space .. not much, mainly moved the rax and armory more to the side and flattened a tiny bit of the surrounding terrain

    On the list:
    - Improve detail on some of the larger mountains, they looked good at first but compared to the detail in center the quality difference is too noticable
    - More playtesting

    Could use feedback on:
    - More detail in the outer circle?
    - Some lava vents here and there? Too gimmicky? Special effects in general?
     
  15. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Some cracks in the ground periodically venting steam would sure look interesting.
     
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  16. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    With some sound effects on top of that it would be beautiful.
     
  17. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    There doesn't happen to be some screen shake earthquake effect right?
     
  18. Xyaminou

    Xyaminou Member

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    There is actually, seismic have a screen shake effect and on Streetsoffire there is that ship that you can summon that makes your screen shake.
    I like where you're going with this.
     
  19. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    My intention now is to scare the crap out of people playing for the first time. A rumble, a massive sound and a majestic jet of steam shooting out of cracks
     
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  20. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Also, there are sounds in Half Life 2 that you can use for that, like rumbling, rocks falling, and jets of steam hissing.
     

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