They're a big group that bring new players to Empires, and those new players will not necessarily be bad ones. I know their server settings aren't hyper-intelligent, and that they were easily trolled by certain community members into angering the community at large, and that they appeal to newbies to join their server and the proceed to clanstack against them every single match, but that's their prerogative and servers like that usually die off anyway. But I wouldn't mind the players sticking around. So what if |-Öç-| is terrible at the game. We should prove it in scrims. If they want to cripple their experience acquisition in this game by stacking against newbies and inventing arcane rules about the employment of mines, let them - although a few members play the real game on other servers too so they may become a decent scrim opponent. Actually, I find it likely they'll abandon some of their foolishness as they play the game more, and arrogance will bleed away or be shamed off. If you have a problem with their 'no-recruiting rule' - just remember that its only on their server and even then it is completely unenforceable - their admins are always only on one team! I can see a problem if someone downloads Empires and Outcast's is their first server then potentially it could turn them off the game, but that could be rectified by recommending that new players try conventional servers first or something. I mean if someone wants to bring a new clan into Empires and an existing roster of new-to-empires people, I don't think this mod has any choice but to welcome them - although I'd expect some of their arrogance to stop, but as I said above, that, I believe was instigated by trolling. If Outcasts is really so old and reputable as Bort claims then they may encourage other such clans to join, further expanding the player base. I mean at least these guys aren't the DDoSers... and if |-Öç-| is Villains let them prove it - withdraw, and see if they start an offensive.