A possible way to fix the problems with vehical handling.

Discussion in 'General' started by Foxy, Dec 15, 2008.

  1. Foxy

    Foxy I lied, def a Forum Troll

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    As I've heard some people complain about, the vehicals in 2.2 feel sluggish, and unlike their 2.12 relatives.

    Messing around on my own server today, mainly with gravity, I found that the vehicals seemed a lot better using setting the gravity to 1500. I remember in 2.12 that the default was 600, and perhaps someone overlooked adjusting it during the conversion.

    They seemed much more responsive, and much more like how they used to be.

    Someone care to look into this, or enlighten me?
     
  2. ScardyBob

    ScardyBob Member

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    I thought the 2.12 default was 800?

    Anyways, wouldn't 1500 screw up the infantry? Your basically doubling the gravity so I would think that infantry wouldn't be able to move as fast or jump as high.
     
  3. Demented

    Demented Member

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    The default was 800. Even in 2.12, making the gravity heavier made the vehicles feel better.

    On the other hand, I couldn't really enjoy how the vehicles in 2.12 handled. I was too worried about spinning out. =P It's not as much of an issue now, and I'll take that over whatever handling 2.12 offered.

    (For what it's worth, there's an 'addgravity' property that makes vehicles heavier for handling purposes. I don't think it's been changed between versions, though.)
     
  4. Foxy

    Foxy I lied, def a Forum Troll

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    Nope. Jump and everything else seemed fine, and unaffected by gravity.

    Although, at times; negative gravity would make infantry float, and at other times, wouldn't.
     
  5. jragbir

    jragbir Member

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    I gotta agree that the vehicle handling in 2.2 seem a bit weird, but ill probably get used to it like everything else.
     
  6. Drag

    Drag Member

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    Thank you for your interest, upping gravity for servers in general seems like a very hacky way to fix anything, don't see how its going to happen.

    There is an "addgravity" command for vehicle chassis and I have tested it extensively. It's currently (and has always been) set to 0.33 for all vehicles.

    Everything below 0.3 gives vehicles buttery suspension/messes up the suspension system as this one relies on body mass of the vehicle.

    Everything above 0.4 or something results in the suspension being compressed more and ultimately restricts vehicles to flat surfaces. It MAY work better on plain ground but the second you hit a slope the vehicle gets FORCED down to the ground sometimes flipping it violently.

    Maybe I'll test a minor increase for some vehicles again but I doubt gravity is the answer. More like wheel size and suspension could help but I don't understand the suspension system at all. And wheel sizes are model-bound :/.
     
  7. Metal Smith

    Metal Smith Member

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    Alright, here's my opinion as to why vehicles feel sluggish.


    When you turn a vehicle, it is set to a turning rate, you can't turn faster or slower than this rate. the rate is linnearly decreased between 2 rates when the vehicle is between set "fast" speeds and "slow" speeds, with the maximum slow speed and minimum fast speed being blah.

    First of all, the turning rate is definitely much lower now. This wouldn't be so apparent if not for another problem with the scripts. It seems laggy because it does not smoothly go from turning left to centered to turning right. Instead, when you turn to the maximum turning angle left, then push right, It will snap back to center.

    Why is this?

    Because the turn rate for a vehicle moving back to centered is much higher than the turn rate of moving away from center. This means you will snap right to center, but then slow down with the turns as you go past center. This causes the "Lag" in vehicle movements.

    After messing with it a little, i've found that setting the vehicle centering speed and the vehicle turning speed to the same number makes the vehicle less laggy feeling. that snap, then stop, then the slow movement makes it feel like it isn't responding, when in fact, it is just slowing down drastically.


    The steering part of the NF light tank vehicle script:

    Does that make sense?

    This might not be all the problem. i've been playing with the turning speeds on my own, and so far, changing them all to 4 and 2 for the steeringrate's will just about make things feel 2.12 ish. The only ones i suggest not changing are the artillery chassis, Com vehicles, and jeeps. Especially not the jeeps. At 4 and 2 they spin out just by tapping a or d.
     
  8. Lockhart

    Lockhart Member

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    that's a crafty fix
     
  9. Omneh

    Omneh Member

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    Jeeps need to be faster. Lots faster. They should be able to outrun bullets, and fly. And mount quad railguns, and nukes, oh wait, HIT missiles.

    That in my opinion would completely balance Empires. :rolleyes:
     
  10. ScardyBob

    ScardyBob Member

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    But won't increasing the steeringrate just cause spinning out?
     
  11. Foxy

    Foxy I lied, def a Forum Troll

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    They should be propelled by HIT missiles. Der.
     
  12. Metal Smith

    Metal Smith Member

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    you have to change the steering rate to adjust for spinning out or laggy/slow feeling movement.

    a 4,2 won't spin out any tanks except for jeeps. I didn't test artillery tanks or commanders because those are weird to drive/ not driven often.

    Also, adjusting the max angle will also help with this, but it will feel a little weird because it won't turn as far as it used to.

    It may also be good to keep these variable slightly separated, because driving on the road, the wheel does straighten itself out quicker than you turn usually.


    The difficult part about making this in empires is that you are either turning full speed or you aren't turning at all. That is where complications arise. If you just play with it, and find a good balance between the snapping to 0 and the build up to the max angle, so that it doesn't feel like lag, then send it to beer dude and see if you can get it into 2.21.


    Either way, you'll need to play with it until it feels right.

    Jeeps just suck.
     
  13. blizzerd

    blizzerd Member

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    are the vehicle scripts still tampered with? or are they considered as final as possible in 2.2?
     
  14. Metal Smith

    Metal Smith Member

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    I'll make a bet if you ask nicely, beer dude or someone could adjust the scripts for 2.21.
     
  15. Foxy

    Foxy I lied, def a Forum Troll

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    My pleasure.
    Hrm, odd. It didn't seem to affect my ability to drive on slopes at all on streetsoffire. But, that was with the global gravity that only sometimes affected infantry.
     
  16. vrooom

    vrooom Member

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    Possible reason to this is that the source engine is pretty interesting when it comes to vehicles, at least as far as my experimentation with vehicles in Garry's Mod goes to show. Seems to me that the engine has a sense of traction with all of the vehicles, so when you turn up the gravity, the vehicles are heavier. This produces additional traction for the vehicles.

    Or I could be completely wrong if the maker(s) of Garry's Mod fucked with the vehicle settings.
     

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