Discussion in 'News' started by MOOtant, Sep 30, 2010.
Seems about right.
The only thing you have ever added to this mod's discussion is acting like a whiny bitch
Get the sand out of your vagina
wall hack withdraw, tis not a pleasant sight.
Do you have some problem with me restating the obvious? FN said it first, I said it second, and Viro agreed.
What do you have to say about the devs not even bothering to lower the target/minimap radius before releasing 2.27 so we can actually play properly? Didn't 2.2 show that releasing stuff that's broken is a bad thing?
BTW: I've presented ideas (*cough* contributing to the discussion *cough*) for every release (including 2.27), most of which were ignored even though they were what the players wanted...
Back on topic: From what I've heard, I'm guessing that 2.28 will clear up most of the issues with 2.26-7.
Go write some code then I'll care.
Thank you devs for the release.
And therein lies the problem...
I indeed didn't see FN's comment, but it's pretty obnoxious of you to rewrite what he said a few comments ago, just so everyone knows how you feel.
I also don't think the current minimap system should be final, so you'll have to ask MOOtant for that. And see you breaking down ideas more often than providing constructive feedback or presenting your own. Case in point: your handy bulleted list. People like Ounin, SIP, Mayama and many others may sometimes bring up silly (or even bad) ideas, but at least they don't bitch about versions that were released years ago.
good points recon, i agree.
also @ anyone who doesnt know why targets were essential: empires is a hard game as it is, targets help confused people know what to shoot at.
I'm fine with targets, but not like this. This is pretty much wallhacks because it takes nothing at all to get spotted. It should be switched to large radar towers that the com places and only those will spot. Once they are destroyed, that area loses its ability to spot until another is up, engineers build there mini ones, or infantry themselves spot.
Old targets were wallhacks so stop whining it's not worse.
The more people who say something is broken, the more likely it is to get fixed.
I've already discussed it with MOOtant and talked over some suggestions, which is why I'm hoping that 2.28 will resolve some of those issues.
The only reason I bring it up is because it's a repeating cycle, and SIP's tool showed a clear decline in players.
So we either have a level playing field where everyone knows where everyone is at all times, or we have one that only those who have a commander to target everything with a target spam to know where everyone is.
Either way it seems that the only thing that has happened is that one bullshit method of making teams uneven has been removed and leveled the playing field. No longer can a team win simply because their com gave targets when the other com did not.
all in all, broken mechanic is broken. Now it's an evenly broken mechanic.
Now, if we make the 5k radius a scout trait, and either remove or limit the radius of the other classes, that could work very well.
but whatever. If you think that being omnicient is a bad thing, then you also think mass targets is bad. you can't have "I don't like being able to see everything!" and "I want commander targets taht can target everything!" at the same time.
I'm in agreement with Metal Smith's post...but you probably know that already.
You've never played without mass targets? Targets, Yes, I believe we need some form of Commander Direction. But I don't believe at all in MASS targets.
Oh right, because of the lack of targets (or other similar features), not because of the DDOS attacks that piss everyone off.
Anyway, you can stop whining because if you've been listening to what most people are saying, future versions shouldn't have the autospot (something more sensible replacing it), weapons will probably take a leap back to 2.12 and Scouts should become less useless.
Mass comm targeting and insane map detection should just not be in game. Engineer cameras and radars should do both those things, but commanders should still have the ability to give single targets.
It's a win-win-win situation, One side doesn't get gay minimap, the other side doesn't get mass targets, and I don't have to hear everyone complain about it in game.
On a side note, I don't think I've ever heard anyone complain about mass targets, I have though heard people complain about the minimap detection, so it seems like they voice their opinions more about the one thing than the other.
as one of the most chatty commanders in empires i have to say that this only makes more advanced tactics more difficult, and teamwork less sophisticated to the point of boredom.
remove targets at all. only show up enemy units on coms minimap, since he is the one who should know whats going on and deciding whether the team needs to know or not. i dont care people bitching at coms for not giving enough info because most of those people are worse coms.
IIRC SIP's graph smooths massive spikes and dips, so I don't think the DOS attacks effected it all that much. I don't think 2.26 has been out long enough to affect the graph. I think the core issue is the quality of releases from 2.2 to 2.23, which were more responsible for the decline than anything else. Yes that's just an opinion, and yes, it's shared by others.
By simple logic, for the sake of growing instead of stifling the player base, I'm asking that the devs try to not repeat that pattern.
Everything I've heard about development from 2.26-7 to the next release has been positive. What bothers me is that 2.26 was released in the state it was. Why not wait for 2.26 to really be finished instead of pushing something broken out the door? Baring that, why not revert it once you got the testing feedback you needed? If 2.26 was really finished, people would still be bitching about the targeting (e.g. my wallhax are gone), but there would be plenty of positive aspects (balance, scout usefulness, no minimap glitches, etc) to discuss as well.
In case it wasn't clear already, I don't disagree with MOOtant's changes to the targeting mechanics; I'm just not a fan of the unfinished implementation that was in 2.26.
I am a fan of reverting things if its borked and then fix and try again.
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