emp_echelon cooperation

Discussion in 'Mapping' started by Silk, Feb 24, 2013.

  1. LordDz_2

    LordDz_2 Strange things happens here

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    If I understand it right, those versions already have instances inside hammer, and this tools allows ALL versions to compile instances into the bsps? :confused:
     
  2. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    Looks like a pretty fortification :)

    At this point though i don't know if it would fit the style, and since i'm hopefully not the one making the brushwork, i can't even guess. But it looks good on it's own and if you're not using it, feel free to put it online and we can decide later.

    Apparantly. Empires uses the 2007 engine in which instances doesn't work, so this is why that guy build this tool so that now it should
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2013
  3. Deadpool

    Deadpool SVETLANNNAAAAAA

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    I think having all that zig zagging uphill will result in people being able to camp too hard with great sight lines... its plenty hard enough to kill shit uphill in empires...

    you're gonna need a couple smaller side paths, and not just that one road uphill. maybe little cuts straight up to the next level, small and winding, but there has to be something to split the attention of the defenders or the attackers are fucked for days.

    really cool map though
     
  4. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Give attackers arty. Ideal for breaking defences.
     
  5. wealthysoup

    wealthysoup Lead Tester

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    Fixed that for you :)


    And yes I agreee with deadpool, although by the sounds of things your planning on having it so infantry can get to the top quite quickly (If i understand right)
     
  6. w00kie

    w00kie Mustachioed Mexican

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    lvl 3 MGs will be fun :D
     
  7. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Just because the average person doesn't know how to use arty does't mean adding it in breaks the game. But there's no changing minds, and the pub community won't ever learn that much arty = bad since they have no access to it ever. And when they do, they WANT arty. And take it.
     
  8. LordDz_2

    LordDz_2 Strange things happens here

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    Emp_escort + arty.
    I rest my case.
     
  9. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    It's a possibility, though you'd be surprised how much of a positive impact detailed displacements can have on the gameplay. On most places the cliff will overhang a bit, so infantry going uphill close to the cliff can't be targeted from above/below/left/right/back and only have to watch out for the front. Vehicles can simply retreat a bit to get repaired under such overhanging rocks, and rush forward again.

    My main concern with the zig zagging is boredom, which for me is a better reason to look into adding alternative routes.

    Edit: I added some temporary detail to the bottom cliffs and some well known rock models for size comparison. I had placed a BE med tank in there as well but somehow during the compile it disappeared.
    The bunker/wall thing for the bottom cliff was just a tryout; it would makes sense in a map like this, and it gives infantry locations to fight for inbetween capture areas.
    The bunker on the fourth image is exactly halfway up the cliff (relatively close to the 3rd map spawn), and could be one of the two infantry only entrances to the base. It would go upwards to the main basewall on top. This would split the attention of both teams to two fronts, with the cliffside road the main entrance (because of the vehicles); ... and even a third front for the second infantry only passage which would be on top.

    4 screenshots:( again, only some gameplay tryouts ...)

    [​IMG]
    https://dl.dropbox.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_echelon/2.jpg
    https://dl.dropbox.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_echelon/3.jpg
    https://dl.dropbox.com/u/234836/mapping/emp_echelon/4.jpg

    (some problems with dropbox at the time of posting, i'll check back tomorrow morning)
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2013
  10. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    make the zig zag thing part of the fortification, cut holes in the disps, add some stairs and rooms (maybe a checkpoint?) and problem solved - more routes
     
  11. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    We think alike

    Check the "edit" part of my previous post ... once dropbox works again :)
     
  12. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    ah, so you have problems to?


    edit:
    hmm now i understand deadpools concerns ... maybe only make 2-3 ramps and then a smaller plateau and then the other 2-3 ramps and a flag inbetween so you dont have to take the whole climb at once?
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2013
  13. Deadpool

    Deadpool SVETLANNNAAAAAA

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    you are going to have to be so precise when you are finalizing this stuff. I mean with... where are the bumps and rocks and sight lines and so on... this has potential to be just godawful terrible if done wrong...

    imo you should finish off that ramp area, to the same level of detail as the bottom bit, and playtest it. I would bet pretty confidently that something glaringly broken will occur, no offense intended, just its the best way to find what exactly the problem will be, cause I am very sure there will be one.

    I tried opening the pic to try and sketch out a different path... to help get away from the fire escape pattern that it is... its not super easy to come up with something in that limited space though.


    edit: oooh idea - you see that giant cliff to the right, that is essentially just a wall atm? if that could provide some way for the attackers to be on the same level as the defenders (more or less ofc) then they would be able to provide cover from there, and it will not be too broken because of the distance between the areas. Im thinkin like a cliff edge with a couple of fallen rocks, something as wide as a third of a rax or so - a rax's width that is. Think of the scene where they try to cross the mountains in LOTR and the snow falls on them :) itd have to be accessed by ladders.... or perhaps a winding tunnel inside of it. Did this rambling make sense?


    i drawed it.... with all that space you could make many of these things to parallel the defenders side... would probably have to have them join with the main path at some point so you dont lose all the noobs on your team ...

    [​IMG][/url] upload photos[/IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2013
  14. LordDz_2

    LordDz_2 Strange things happens here

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    How about a big underground fight perhaps? Like the "inside" of a bunker. I know that BigTeef wanted to have fights with corridors in a map.
     
  15. BigTeef

    BigTeef Bootleg Headshot master

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    You know those tunnels in the map of streets of fire?
    Or that loading screen with the tight corridor and the guy is taking heavy fire by nf troops.
    I want that as a whole map.

    Tight close quarter tunnels, claustrophobic areas.
    I want the Tantive IV experience

    See I already like the look of this map mostly because its different and its on the brink of most people's comfort zones.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2013
  16. Deadpool

    Deadpool SVETLANNNAAAAAA

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    there's comfort zones and then there's not wanting more rainbow roads
     
  17. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    I will work on the ramp first so it's definitely possible to release a testversion of the map. Though i'm not nearly as concerned with the long road as you guys are.

    NF heavies (and later BE mediums) can steamroll up there cause apart from 9-mining BE (and later NF) doesn't have a lot of good defensive positions to hold back tanks from; and once you're halfway the cliff, you can spawn your vehicles right there. Also once you're halfway you are divided amongst two fronts, the underground battle towards the base and the cliffroad battle. People like me will definitely be fighting outside, people like BigTeef will be fighting in the bunker corridors.

    But we'll see, still way too early.

    And my main concern by far is the escort styled concrete base. No one has offered to help with that yet, and the urban part is one of the 3 big battle areas. It should have 2 routes towards the flags all the time, height advantages, .... etc. Not easy to make.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2013
  18. D.D.D. Destroyer

    D.D.D. Destroyer Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Escort has little ceiling/roof coverage and only one side of the fence gets vehicles and thus arty.


    You could make a single spawner for an arty tank and thus limit the whorespam.


    Not to mention you shouldn't balance the game around a map.
     
  19. Silk

    Silk Mapper

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    What about this suggestion:

    [​IMG]

    From on top off a cliff, this is what the defenders can see: (but they are very visible there themselves)
    [​IMG]

    While underneath them this is going on:
    [​IMG]
     
  20. flasche

    flasche Member Staff Member Moderator

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    oh - i got the size totally wrong. its about twice as big as i thought ...
     

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