Put an ammo crate in the refineries.

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by Aquillion, Jun 4, 2009.

  1. Aquillion

    Aquillion Member

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    Most comms never drop armories. Most players ignore ref notes after the beginning of the game, not bothering to defend or fight for them.

    This suggestion would help solve both. If ref nodes had an ammo box in them, infantry would have a direct reason to stay near them and defend them. You might actually see fights centered around res nodes directly, epic res-node defense attempts, and so on -- I think that that would be a good thing.

    Possibly, they could even have health crates added. Yes, it might seem like a big deal... but armories only cost 75 res, and you can only place res nodes in a few key places.

    This might make armories a bit more redundant, but you can still drop an armory anywhere, and it lets you change class. And the fact is, people don't use armories enough. Rather than trying to struggle with the player base and make them use in the intended way, I think, in this case, it might be better to try and make the way things are now work more smoothly.

    Of course, it wouldn't really be in the refineries, but sort of up against their side, as part of their model. You get the idea.

    Basically, comms really really love to get refs. Infantry really really love to get armories. But these two things just don't seem to work out. Combine them, and everyone will be encouraged to do what they're supposed to do.
     
  2. Fricken Hamster

    Fricken Hamster Mr. Super Serious

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    Armories are good substitutes for barracks in beginning when you don't have money or in places where there isn't the space. Good coms will take advantage of the armoury's cheap cost, quick refreshments and easy placablity. The players you describe suck. A huge attack on one ref node might be hard to stop, but usually its just a jeep full of scouts on engineers to raid ref nodes in the middle. Keep people in tanks patrolling between bases to make sure noone takes your ref. Part of Empires is the discipline to make seemingly pointless patrol trips.
     
  3. Aquillion

    Aquillion Member

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    They do suck, but the game's design should try and encourage them to not suck. It's better to focus on making Empires a fun game than in punishing players for playing it wrong -- it should be as easy as possible for a "good game" to happen. Optimally, every game would be go well, and there would be no failteams.

    We can't go inside of people's heads to make them perfect players, but we can shape the gameplay in a way that subtly encourages good gameplay -- we can't brainwash every player into patrolling your refs (I think most wouldn't do it no matter how much it benefits them), but we can design the game in a way that naturally encourages players to hang around near refs. I think that this would be a step in the right direction.

    I'm not saying, of course, that a team that neglects its refs should be able to beat a team that defends and patrols them (just the opposite.) But the game should encourage people to defend their refineries. Right now infantry don't have enough reasons to value refs -- the fact is, many players just don't think that hard about them. So I think it would be worth giving refs some direct benefit to infantry like this, encouraging them to stay near them, defend them, and fight for them in a natural fashion.

    Now, this would also tend to help teams that have a bad comm who doesn't drop armories. But that deals with another issue -- the game should still at least be moderately fun, even with a somewhat bad comm.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2009
  4. -=SIP=-

    -=SIP=- Member

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    Don't see the need for change.
    The commander should be an experienced player. Empires will never work good with a noob commander.
    So if commander doesn't place armories, then it's only his fault.
    And it's also the function of the commander to have a look on the ressources and to push the players to get the refinieries.
     
  5. Dawgas

    Dawgas Banned

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    armories are only good for walls

    if you try to use them as the game intends, you have infantry fucking standing in there being an easy kill for some apc or tank or whatever faggot on the enemy team who decides to take melee upgrade


    also, whoever thinks refineries are not important are what we call "noobs"
     
  6. Sneaky

    Sneaky Member

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    Armories make all the difference on a frontline, at the very least they save you tickets. But The frontline in Empires tends to move rather quickly, so armories usually end up being placed near the rax.
     
  7. Aquillion

    Aquillion Member

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    Their benefit for infantry is situational, since you have to waste time entering them and an APC can do the same thing on the go. They're still useful in key areas, especially places where you can't fit barracks, partially because they let you change class -- being able to suddenly turn into a rifleman when there's enemy infantry nearby is a big advantage.

    More important, though, is their benefit for tanks -- they automatically reload any tanks in their aura. On more open maps, non-engineer drivers benefit from this a lot. Even engineer drivers can benefit when you're using something with low ammo, like HE; if you're shooting constantly and moving around a lot, you can easily find yourself unable to drop another ammo box when you need one.
     
  8. PreDominance

    PreDominance Member

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    As a commander, I place an armory near the rax, and one on the front lines.
    However, it seems like the only necessity is the rax-armory. Most players die before they use all der ammos.
     
  9. Ikalx

    Ikalx Member

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    Hey, that's a good idea...I might start putting armouries around my refs instead of just near the raxen..

    But otherwise? I think you're better off making a bunker upgrade for refs or something...
     
  10. Alceister

    Alceister Member

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    I think mappers should leave occasional ammo crates throughout the map.
     
  11. ScardyBob

    ScardyBob Member

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    I don't like dropping armories because that is res that I could be spending getting an edge on research, building tanks, buildings refs/turrets/racks/etc. While armories have more purposes than providing ammo/health (i.e. walls, place to change class), I'd rather have engies dropping ammo/healing.

    I like this idea because then I wouldn't be dependent on emp_recruit figuring out how to use his calculator properly.
     
  12. Drag

    Drag Member

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    Armories are the most important thing you can place, it makes such a huge difference since it doesnt require an engineer with a brain for you to get ammo and health. You can also quickly change class in it. The armory fits nearly everywhere and doesnt cost much. Its the very best thing you can do for your team. Every good player will thank you a thousandfold for a well placed armory.
     
  13. Sirex

    Sirex Member

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    Yeah why not. Really like the idea that it can rearm tanks also. Thus you might see withdrawl of tank forces to a back rez to rearm and other epic things.
     
  14. ScardyBob

    ScardyBob Member

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    I understand your point and I do drop more armories than I used too, but I still don't like too. There are no functions unique to an armory. Engineers can drop ammo and heal, you can change classes in a barracks, and walls are generally cheaper/more effective than armories. The first 10 minutes of commanding are the most important in research/tanks/etc that in a well-balanced game, the 75 res might make the difference between a win and a loss. If the armory had a unique function not available elsewhere, I would use it more often.
     
  15. Ikalx

    Ikalx Member

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    Saves more lives on my team than anything else, most of the time. With the increased cost of barracks, armouries have really become a building of choice for me. Not safe? Armoury...forward position? Armoury...and it really helps in area capture.

    But then, I like to go the whole hog - barracks, armoury and two turrets...just because it's so much more help for the team when they're not all vets etc.
     

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